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Default Interesting Findings Comparing Maps - 07-24-2017, 11:44 AM

I have many logs over the past couple of months... Here are a few comparing various maps...

As I suspected Map 6 with FLAT 2 PSI on my car yielded strongest pull - that is clear in the logs also using these graphs...

Whats interesting is Map 1 is is the worst followed by MAP 5 with a flat 17 PSI..

Any thoughts?
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Last edited by risktaker76; 07-24-2017 at 12:03 PM..
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Default 07-27-2017, 07:10 PM

Map 6 with flat 2 psi?


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Default 07-27-2017, 08:57 PM

When you use "flat 2 psi" is adding 2 psi to the stock boost level. Maybe with your type of fuel the engine runs without too much corrections at that boost so the pull will be the hardest and smoothest.


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Default 07-28-2017, 05:42 AM

I normalized the time scale which was throwing off my analysis...
Pretty much what I am seeing is that as temps get cooler greater timing is introduced and boost is retarded - however performance improves..

Its pretty clear - Timing has a greater effect than boost...

So far my best map is map6 with additive 3PSI to 4500 RPM then taper down to 2PSI to MAX RSPM.

This is on my 440xi MPPSK...

As you can see MAP0 is the worst of them all - HOWEVER! it was also the hottest temps... thus I need to set back to map0 and do another run with cooler temps to confirm this.

If Terry could add MPH (Velocity) to the log file at a time interval then we can surely perform far more accurate calculations and easily determine which map is performing better.
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Last edited by risktaker76; 07-28-2017 at 06:27 AM..
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Default 08-04-2017, 12:45 PM

How do i use map 6 to set it to an additive target instead of actual target?
If i set it from 8psi to ramp ut to lets say 16, that is the actual target.
But what i want to set it to additive lets say start at 4psi and ramp up to 8psi, how do i do that?
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Default 08-04-2017, 01:00 PM

For one I would NOT put in any target so aggressive as 8psi without prior testing. In fact as you increase RPM your boost decreases while your timing increases thus there is no ramping up to 8psi - you usually ramp down to stay the same and let the additive nature control the drop...

My advice would be is to start with Map 1 2 or 3. See if you can maintain boost at target without losing ignition... If lets say Map 3 boost is holding to target (or going above target) define map 6 with those targets but more linear (4.0 4.0 4.0 3.0 2.0, etc.). Anything under 10 PSI is additive.. So if you put in 4.. that means whatever the DME and JB4 determines it will add 4PSI above that. If you said 18PSI that is absolute... Its safe to test 17 or 18 PSI across the board... Many of us have with little issues. The best absolute was 18 psi up to 5k then ramped down to 16 psi from there... however for my car (MPPSK) 3psi additive ramp down to 2psi above 5k rpm its not only smoothest but most power.

All other settings must be set to default..
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Default 08-04-2017, 01:04 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by risktaker76
For one I would NOT put in any target so aggressive as 8psi without prior testing. In fact as you increase RPM your boost decreases while your timing increases thus there is no ramping up to 8psi - you usually ramp down to stay the same and let the additive nature control the drop...

My advice would be is to start with Map 1 2 or 3. See if you can maintain boost at target without losing ignition... If lets say Map 3 boost is holding to target (or going above target) define map 6 with those targets but more linear (4.0 4.0 4.0 3.0 2.0, etc.). Anything under 10 PSI is additive.. So if you put in 4.. that means whatever the DME and JB4 determines it will add 4PSI above that. If you said 18PSI that is absolute... Its safe to test 17 or 18 PSI across the board... Many of us have with little issues. The best absolute was 18 psi up to 5k then ramped down to 16 psi from there... however for my car (MPPSK) 3psi additive ramp down to 2psi above 5k rpm its not only smoothest but most power.

All other settings must be set to default..
Okay..
Im well aware of this and i already have different map 6 that works fine depending on how i use the car.
The values were just used as an illustration, i could have called them X and Y, but for simplicty i gave them an actual number..

My questions was not regarding the actual values, more on how i need to setup Map 6 so that is it additive and not looks at the values as a fixed value.
Lets say i can run 6psi and 8psi additive, how do i set it up?
If i want 15psi i just set it to 15 as it is right now, but i have no idea on how to set Map 6 to be additive.
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Default 08-04-2017, 01:09 PM

Nothing special --- any value below 10 is additive above 10 absolute
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Default 08-04-2017, 01:09 PM

Also could you provide the logs for 2psi flat and 17psi flat, im more used to looking at the .csv files.
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Default 08-04-2017, 01:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by risktaker76
Nothing special --- any value below 10 is additive above 10 absolute
Oh okay, it is that simple. Thanks!
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Default 08-04-2017, 01:39 PM

Here is one better... All my runs with some graphs..

Its going to give you an error when you try to open it... just accept it as I needed to change the extension from xlsx to xls to save space... this site only allows XLS (which the file then is too large) also.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
Also could you provide the logs for 2psi flat and 17psi flat, im more used to looking at the .csv files.
Attached Files
File Type: xls JB4 Analysis (Autosaved) (2).xls (92.2 KB, 87 views)
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Default 08-04-2017, 02:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by risktaker76
Here is one better... All my runs with some graphs..

Its going to give you an error when you try to open it... just accept it as I needed to change the extension from xlsx to xls to save space... this site only allows XLS (which the file then is too large) also.
Cant open it unfortunately.
Im running openoffice and it says the file is corrupt and wants to repair it, if i press yes it says its not possible and aborts, if i press no it just aborts.
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Default 08-04-2017, 03:47 PM

Try changing the extension to xlsx

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
Cant open it unfortunately.
Im running openoffice and it says the file is corrupt and wants to repair it, if i press yes it says its not possible and aborts, if i press no it just aborts.
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Default 08-05-2017, 07:57 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
How do i use map 6 to set it to an additive target instead of actual target?
If i set it from 8psi to ramp ut to lets say 16, that is the actual target.
But what i want to set it to additive lets say start at 4psi and ramp up to 8psi, how do i do that?
It's not that simple with the B58. The stock DME BT is always changing, and the additive that you put into the JB4 will always be directly above the current DME BT. There is no way to predict what the DME BT will be, based on currently public data. I'm sure someone at BMW knows exactly how to predict it, but none of us have figured it out.

In my experience, mixing additive with absolute targets will result in very jerky and not smooth acceleration. Give it a shot and post your results.


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Default 08-06-2017, 04:49 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullitt1841
It's not that simple with the B58. The stock DME BT is always changing, and the additive that you put into the JB4 will always be directly above the current DME BT. There is no way to predict what the DME BT will be, based on currently public data. I'm sure someone at BMW knows exactly how to predict it, but none of us have figured it out.

In my experience, mixing additive with absolute targets will result in very jerky and not smooth acceleration. Give it a shot and post your results.
There seems to be some mayor misunderstandings here.
First of all i do not have a B58, i own a M135 with the N55 engine.
Secondly i have no intentions of mixing additive and absolute targets, i was just wondering how the software would know if the values that i put into it was meant to be additive or absolute values

Last edited by Snowman; 08-06-2017 at 05:27 AM..
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Default 08-06-2017, 08:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
There seems to be some mayor misunderstandings here.
First of all i do not have a B58, i own a M135 with the N55 engine.
Secondly i have no intentions of mixing additive and absolute targets, i was just wondering how the software would know if the values that i put into it was meant to be additive or absolute values
This thread is specifically about the B58 engine. I have no idea how the N55 JB4 works.


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Default 08-06-2017, 08:49 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bullitt1841
This thread is specifically about the B58 engine. I have no idea how the N55 JB4 works.
Oh okay, since there were no information in the thread title or in the first post about b58 I didn't know it only covered b58.
Also the Android app is the same for n55 and b58, you just choose f or e-series..
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Default 08-06-2017, 10:40 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman
Oh okay, since there were no information in the thread title or in the first post about b58 I didn't know it only covered b58.
Also the Android app is the same for n55 and b58, you just choose f or e-series..
Problem solved. Now we have our own subforum


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Default 08-07-2017, 12:15 PM

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Problem solved. Now we have our own subforum
finally!


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Default 04-15-2018, 10:55 AM

Hi all,

I like this thread. I am playing with map 6 also. 16 psig flat seems like a good start.

The smoothest run I have found so far is attached. Very little jerking, minimal throttle plate action, and getting to target nicely. I do wonder about variability with temperatures...makes a big difference along with elevation....I will look at that more closely.

Regarding the attached run I am thinking of dropping the gain to 8 to lessen the oscillation and also change the DPG to reduce overshoot during the initial boost.

Also, I am wondering if the PWM and FF readings should not be higher. These are essentially bottomed out. To me that means less control over possible changes.

Problems? Thoughts?

Thanks,

Alex
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2018-03-29 14_07_49map6 16psig 10g fol70 base.csv (8.1 KB, 35 views)


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Default 04-15-2018, 01:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turboh
Hi all,

I like this thread. I am playing with map 6 also. 16 psig flat seems like a good start.

The smoothest run I have found so far is attached. Very little jerking, minimal throttle plate action, and getting to target nicely. I do wonder about variability with temperatures...makes a big difference along with elevation....I will look at that more closely.

Regarding the attached run I am thinking of dropping the gain to 8 to lessen the oscillation and also change the DPG to reduce overshoot during the initial boost.

Also, I am wondering if the PWM and FF readings should not be higher. These are essentially bottomed out. To me that means less control over possible changes.

Problems? Thoughts?

Thanks,

Alex
  1. Update your firmware to V9
  2. Set FUA to 10
  3. Set 6-Cyl Timing Mode to 0

Post more logs after that. Otherwise, this one looks decent. Just need to get timing a little higher.


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Default 04-16-2018, 06:27 AM

OK. How do I get timing a little higher without fuel additives? Drop boost?

Thanks


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Default 04-16-2018, 07:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turboh
OK. How do I get timing a little higher without fuel additives? Drop boost?

Thanks
Timing should sort itself out with more pulls. 16 PSI and 93 octane is very conservative. Try the new firmware and settings and post up 3 good, clean pulls.


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Default 04-16-2018, 09:30 AM

Finally a normal thread. Everyone needs to only use MAP 6 in my honest opinion. Ill be doing one soon and will post the end results soon.
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Icon1 04-20-2018, 12:39 PM

OK Bullitt,

You are my hero!!!

Did as suggested. Updated firmware, gain down to 8, ran map6 at 16.5 flat. Raised duty bias by5 for most rpms. Best best run is attached.

I really like this setup. It is very smooth. The best ever. Timing is better (almost no"0"), but still not reaching target.

I am think raising the gain by 1 point might help.

Suggestions?

Thanks

Alex


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