N54Tech.com - International Turbo Racing Discussion
(#1)
Old
aaronson1 aaronson1 is offline
New Member
 
Posts: 12
Join Date: Oct 2021
Car: 2017 Elantra Sport
Default Elantra Sport - 10-13-2021, 09:58 AM

Hello everyone I'm new to the forum and new to the hyundai/kia platform. Ive been doing as much research as possible. I'm leaning in between a custom tune and JB4. I was wanting to make around 230-250 wheel on 93 octane, something where reliability isn't really an issue. using an upgraded FMIC from sxth element, their intake, pierce motorsports down pipe, tork mid-pipe, hks mx45 spark plugs. and whatever other supporting mods. Firstly is this a viable power level with those mods and the JB4? Secondly, what are the 1.6 gamma motors able to hold before the turbo, motor and fuel system taps out? assume I'm 100% ignorant.
Reply With Quote
(#2)
Old
Djfourmonie Djfourmonie is offline
Junior Member
 
Posts: 361
Join Date: Jul 2020
Car: 2020 Kia Forte GT
Default 12-04-2021, 11:28 PM

1) Nobody actually knows the engines limits. The fuel system? It will always flow more fuel on gasoline vs ethanol but you'll always be knock limited on any unleaded racing fuel.

2) JB4 doesn't care about your bolt-ons, assuming everything (FBO) on pump gas would be around 240-250 hp, maybe less as I said knock limited by pump gas.

JB4 with 91 octane and WMI made 227 hp on my car. That is stock, only mods being the JB4 and WMI. There is more there actually, all the "mods' aren't needed just optimization.


2020 Kia Forte GT
6 Speed Manual
JB4+Bluetooth Connect
Burger Motorsports Water Methanol (45/55 mix)
Whiteline Springs

13.77@103
Map 7, E30+WMI, Hoosier Drag Radials
E85 Station Locator (US Only)
Reply With Quote
(#3)
Old
aaronson1 aaronson1 is offline
New Member
 
Posts: 12
Join Date: Oct 2021
Car: 2017 Elantra Sport
Default 12-05-2021, 11:37 AM

I actually found an answer to my question elsewhere after digging.

1) The head will start lifting above 250-280 wheel, so you'll need head studs at that point, then internal wise you're good until around 350ish or below wheel. The turbo however will need to be upgraded to a stuffed one well before that.

2) as for the fueling options, using a sonanta 2.0t HPFP is been shown to support over 400 wheel on the veloster N model and I believe thats what sxth element sells. THat or you can use te 3.3T HPFP out of the genesis or stinger. Keep in mind the cam profiles on these motors are different, but their fuel systems easily support 450 wheel. KDM tuners sell Deastch werks fuel pumps that can be fitted to the in-tank bucket for more fuel supply to your stock HPFP. Essentially the goal with all of this is to be able to run just e85 and not have to worry about mixing.

3) the most important is, custom tuning. The JB4 is fantatsic at learning and an amazing product and more than enough for 98% of owners that want basically the same setup that you're runnning, a clean 200+ wheel and call it a day. However for the 2% that may want something a little quicker and bespoke custom tuning is a must, and I think sxth element is probably the best out there in America, or Tork if you don't mind the brashness of the owner.
Reply With Quote
(#4)
Old
Djfourmonie Djfourmonie is offline
Junior Member
 
Posts: 361
Join Date: Jul 2020
Car: 2020 Kia Forte GT
Default 12-06-2021, 12:46 AM

Do you even understand what you just posted? I'll wait...


2020 Kia Forte GT
6 Speed Manual
JB4+Bluetooth Connect
Burger Motorsports Water Methanol (45/55 mix)
Whiteline Springs

13.77@103
Map 7, E30+WMI, Hoosier Drag Radials
E85 Station Locator (US Only)
Reply With Quote
(#5)
Old
aaronson1 aaronson1 is offline
New Member
 
Posts: 12
Join Date: Oct 2021
Car: 2017 Elantra Sport
Default 12-06-2021, 11:03 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Djfourmonie
Do you even understand what you just posted? I'll wait...
You know honestly not worth my time. Thank you for your response, but Iíll continue to find out things on my own accord. Weíll just agree to disagree
Reply With Quote
(#6)
Old
Djfourmonie Djfourmonie is offline
Junior Member
 
Posts: 361
Join Date: Jul 2020
Car: 2020 Kia Forte GT
Default 12-06-2021, 03:18 PM

I read the entire thing before you or somebody else deleted it.

Stuffed (so-called, ridiculous naming btw) still don't produce enough cylinder pressure to require head studs, that is silly. At most 50 hp gain on pump gas and over 320-330 on E85 blend.

Upgraded internals are still not required at such a low power level, but if you are willing to follow the herd and spend the by all means.

E50 is the limit of the stock electronics, not the fuel system itself. Doesn't matter because 97% of the benefits of E85 come at 20% blends, per DOE.

None of the so-called tuners in this space have pushed the limits. Why? It's a different generation. More importance is placed on 0-60 metrics and 60-130 roll racing which funny enough are all measurements of power and speeds, not diametrically opposed from each other.

If any of the so-called experts want to step forward and challenge me they are welcome to. Lord knows they have enough minions that would take up that challenge and then try to setup some ****amamie rules to keep my experience actually racing at bay.

The car is much faster than high 13's at 103 mph, I am not going to disclose what else I have done but it's floating around the internet.

100% stock other than that, air box, inter-cooler, exhaust, everything.


2020 Kia Forte GT
6 Speed Manual
JB4+Bluetooth Connect
Burger Motorsports Water Methanol (45/55 mix)
Whiteline Springs

13.77@103
Map 7, E30+WMI, Hoosier Drag Radials
E85 Station Locator (US Only)
Reply With Quote
(#7)
Old
aaronson1 aaronson1 is offline
New Member
 
Posts: 12
Join Date: Oct 2021
Car: 2017 Elantra Sport
Default 12-22-2021, 12:03 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Djfourmonie
I read the entire thing before you or somebody else deleted it.

Stuffed (so-called, ridiculous naming btw) still don't produce enough cylinder pressure to require head studs, that is silly. At most 50 hp gain on pump gas and over 320-330 on E85 blend.

Upgraded internals are still not required at such a low power level, but if you are willing to follow the herd and spend the by all means.

E50 is the limit of the stock electronics, not the fuel system itself. Doesn't matter because 97% of the benefits of E85 come at 20% blends, per DOE.

None of the so-called tuners in this space have pushed the limits. Why? It's a different generation. More importance is placed on 0-60 metrics and 60-130 roll racing which funny enough are all measurements of power and speeds, not diametrically opposed from each other.

If any of the so-called experts want to step forward and challenge me they are welcome to. Lord knows they have enough minions that would take up that challenge and then try to setup some ****amamie rules to keep my experience actually racing at bay.

The car is much faster than high 13's at 103 mph, I am not going to disclose what else I have done but it's floating around the internet.

100% stock other than that, air box, inter-cooler, exhaust, everything.

I can level with you there's a lot of BS floating around, and the more I dig the more I find it. The stuffed turbo term comes from a well known tuner which ill leave anonymous. I've always called them hybrid turbos. The head stud comment was also made by a well known shop. I'm only regurgitating what I found out. That being said, if the platform can support 300 wheel easily then that's great because that's what I'm going for.
Reply With Quote
(#8)
Old
Djfourmonie Djfourmonie is offline
Junior Member
 
Posts: 361
Join Date: Jul 2020
Car: 2020 Kia Forte GT
Default 12-22-2021, 06:02 PM

I'm at 290-300 whp already. At some point I will put it on the dyno again, won't say who's but I have been on D Sports twice.

There is no reason to push for torque below a certain point unless you can put it down, spinning isn't winning.

You can get to 300 whp, lots of cars are at 270 whp, stock block, pump gas and WMI.

30 extra horsepower doesn't create that much more cylinder pressure. In-cylinder temperature is much more of a problem, that is what expands rings which causes the majority of bottom end problems when the ends butt together.

The only tuner I would trust is Sxth Element, but the problem I have with them is they are more interested in using Solidworks and creating crackle and pop tunes than winning competitions which improves the breed.

The main reason I went with Burger and JB4 over flashing because of the support to blow people out of the water. BMW owners already know, they have Cobb available. The fastest cars are flashed + JB4, including big turbo cars.

If I can get the manifolding straighten out and under what a typical upgraded stock turbo cost, I am going that route.

But for now, the kids running a certain Canadian's flash are all saying they are better than me as if running high 13's and 5.5 0-60 was the goal.

Only a decent 60 ft time from running 12's.


2020 Kia Forte GT
6 Speed Manual
JB4+Bluetooth Connect
Burger Motorsports Water Methanol (45/55 mix)
Whiteline Springs

13.77@103
Map 7, E30+WMI, Hoosier Drag Radials
E85 Station Locator (US Only)
Reply With Quote
(#9)
Old
aaronson1 aaronson1 is offline
New Member
 
Posts: 12
Join Date: Oct 2021
Car: 2017 Elantra Sport
Default 12-22-2021, 06:55 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Djfourmonie
I'm at 290-300 whp already. At some point I will put it on the dyno again, won't say who's but I have been on D Sports twice.

There is no reason to push for torque below a certain point unless you can put it down, spinning isn't winning.

You can get to 300 whp, lots of cars are at 270 whp, stock block, pump gas and WMI.

30 extra horsepower doesn't create that much more cylinder pressure. In-cylinder temperature is much more of a problem, that is what expands rings which causes the majority of bottom end problems when the ends butt together.

The only tuner I would trust is Sxth Element, but the problem I have with them is they are more interested in using Solidworks and creating crackle and pop tunes than winning competitions which improves the breed.

The main reason I went with Burger and JB4 over flashing because of the support to blow people out of the water. BMW owners already know, they have Cobb available. The fastest cars are flashed + JB4, including big turbo cars.

If I can get the manifolding straighten out and under what a typical upgraded stock turbo cost, I am going that route.

But for now, the kids running a certain Canadian's flash are all saying they are better than me as if running high 13's and 5.5 0-60 was the goal.

Only a decent 60 ft time from running 12's.

Iím waiting for a manifold as well, even considered trying a genesis coupe 2t manifold and R&D ing the thing to make it work on our platform. That way we can run port injection. Supposedly KDM tuners made an announcement a while back about having an intake manifold in the works but who knows on that.

Like I would always say and still say to the mustang owners that I tune, just get the parts that work. You can be different to an extent, but when youíre trying to run a number say 8s itís known either whipple or turbo, fuel system, tire, and suspension. Do what works, JB4 works and has been proven time and time on the n54/55 powered platform. Thereís no reason it canít make power on the 1.6 gamma

Also I know what you mean everyone thinks theyíre super fast and special till they get gapped or their car is only good at roll racing, but slow when it comes to digs. Itís the same across all platforms trust me on that. Itís worse in the V8 world.
Reply With Quote
(#10)
Old
Djfourmonie Djfourmonie is offline
Junior Member
 
Posts: 361
Join Date: Jul 2020
Car: 2020 Kia Forte GT
Default 12-22-2021, 07:06 PM

Agreed, not that much worse. The bad mouthing and cursing it worse but the lack of knowledge isn't present.

I mostly hang around the Yellow Bullet forums.


2020 Kia Forte GT
6 Speed Manual
JB4+Bluetooth Connect
Burger Motorsports Water Methanol (45/55 mix)
Whiteline Springs

13.77@103
Map 7, E30+WMI, Hoosier Drag Radials
E85 Station Locator (US Only)
Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump




vBulletin Skin developed by: vBStyles.com
Copyright © 2007 - 2020, N54tech.com