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Endeav Endeav is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 10:17 AM

Thomas, I have one log request from you as I notice you have a PS2 turbo equipped to your N55. Do you mind taking a log of you going from cruising to 100% throttle at a higher RPM, say 5K WOT?

This is the situation in which my PS2 N55 would always crash prior to methanol injection. I could run 18 PSI without problem if I went WOT at low RPM and allowed the pump to build pressure as the turbo spooked, but if I ever went WOT at say.. 5K RPM (downshift situation for example) the pump would instantly crash because it couldnít provide the fuel pressure fast enough.

If your pump doesnít crash in this situation I feel as though as you might have found a winner for cheap replacement! Itís really show how stout this pump is.


'17 BMW M2 - [DCT/N55] - PureTurbos Stage 2 Turbo - JB4 + MHD BEF - Fuel-It Methanol PI
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 10:38 AM

i can try it in the next few days , as im awaiting an updated map from wedge


M135i PWG , FBO , PS2 , LPFP st2 , HDP6 custom for N55 , wedge MHD mapping , XHP AT8
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maxihari maxihari is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 11:29 AM

Would this work for 2011 N55? (early build N55)..

Thanks


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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 11:57 AM

if your hpfp looks a lot different than the pictures it wont work


M135i PWG , FBO , PS2 , LPFP st2 , HDP6 custom for N55 , wedge MHD mapping , XHP AT8
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ceedawg ceedawg is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 11:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Endeav
Thomas, I have one log request from you as I notice you have a PS2 turbo equipped to your N55. Do you mind taking a log of you going from cruising to 100% throttle at a higher RPM, say 5K WOT?

This is the situation in which my PS2 N55 would always crash prior to methanol injection. I could run 18 PSI without problem if I went WOT at low RPM and allowed the pump to build pressure as the turbo spooked, but if I ever went WOT at say.. 5K RPM (downshift situation for example) the pump would instantly crash because it couldn’t provide the fuel pressure fast enough.

If your pump doesn’t crash in this situation I feel as though as you might have found a winner for cheap replacement! It’s really show how stout this pump is.
1000000%




Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
i can try it in the next few days , as im awaiting an updated map from wedge
Yes please as I have a purchased pump on hold. Logging your findings will be the most important thing if we are to know for sure if the fuel pressure and flow capacity of this pump is up to par with an upgraded turbo and could potentially save us hundreds of dollars.
It might be but I’m sure it will need a tune. The B58 has higher compression,a bigger turbo,exhaust ,** all bigger than the N55 setup etc etc so I’m concluding that there are higher fuel requirements for the B58 than an N55 motored car just for the reasons I mention. But I am anxious to see you log this out as one poster stated under 100% WOT 2nd 3rd and 4th gears. I’m staying tuned.


2015 335i Xdrive Msport FBO BM3 Stg 2 93 oct
1995 Eagle talon TSi AWD 612awhp e85
1998 AMG c43 to 55 5.5L conversion FBO Kleemann Superchip custom SW 307whp 329wtq
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 12:57 PM

such a pump isnt rocket science . simple but sturdy plunger design , an internal bleed valve and a an input control valve . your dme's sets a rail target and the pump tries to follow suit , it doenst care what turbo or else is mounted
it just tries to do what the dme asks . and if it cant hold up , your rail pressure drops , notice the pulsation dampener on top
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M135i PWG , FBO , PS2 , LPFP st2 , HDP6 custom for N55 , wedge MHD mapping , XHP AT8

Last edited by T_H_O_M_A_S; 03-05-2019 at 01:06 PM..
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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 02:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
such a pump isnt rocket science . simple but sturdy plunger design , an internal bleed valve and a an input control valve . your dme's sets a rail target and the pump tries to follow suit , it doenst care what turbo or else is mounted
it just tries to do what the dme asks . and if it cant hold up , your rail pressure drops , notice the pulsation dampener on top
Congrats.

You made +14bhp peak power with the upgrade than with your older N55 OEM stock pump with all your other upgrades and PS2 Turbos. Stock turbo and other OEM parts would make less than that.

And if power isn’t the bottom line, what is?

EDIT: Had datalogs reversed. B58 HPFP actually made 14bhp LESS peak than stock

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB90
Incorrect.

It’s common for a tuner to target a lower rail pressure when using the oem hpfp, especially when you are on the edge of what it can flow.

You need to factor in load/boost, afr and iat’s to get a decent picture of how the hpfp is managing. Just because your oem hpfp held 2600psi doesn’t mean it’s stronger.

You can quite clearly see the oem hpfp struggling to maintain the requested 2000 psi, after adding the evo hpfp it maintains this without issue. The requested 2000 psi won’t change until the tuner changes this in his tune.

Another source has stated this pump flows 13% more over the oem. Going off of this it isn’t as strong as the xdi-35. However that 13% should run some decent numbers on a ps2 and certainly max out the oem turbo. We won’t know for sure until someone tests and tries.
I see the upgrade still struggling to hold 2000 PSI.

Regardless, some people would rather run on lower pressure and on the ragged edge over 2k. Well wait till the first one blows up and a used engine is 15K installed.

Tuners lower pressure to put squeeze a little further however the problem still is the problem. If that's the solution then turn the requested pressure to 1800 and the stock pump will hold 18 psi, no need for an upgrade. One could tune with 18 psi low fuel pressure and no timing and could make 350 hp. Which would not require a pump at all.

AGAIN, who cares how much boost if your not making power.

XDI or PI is night and day over this. Certainly more than 14bhp with a PS2 and all the other upgraded parts.

EDIT: Had datalogs reversed. B58 HPFP actually made 14bhp LESS peak than stock

Last edited by IK6SPEED; 03-08-2019 at 08:38 PM..
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DB90 DB90 is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 03:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by IK6SPEED
I see the upgrade still struggling to hold 2000 PSI.

Regardless, some people would rather run on lower pressure and on the ragged edge over 2k. Well wait till the first one blows up and a used engine is 15K installed.

Tuners lower pressure to put squeeze a little further however the problem still is the problem. If that's the solution then turn the requested pressure to 1800 and the stock pump will hold 18 psi, no need for an upgrade. One could tune with 18 psi low fuel pressure and no timing and could make 350 hp. Which would not require a pump at all.

AGAIN, who cares how much boost if your not making power.

XDI or PI is night and day over this. Certainly more than 14bhp with a PS2 and all the other upgraded parts.
Why so much anger and hate, itís hilarious 😂

Why not be open minded and wait for some solid results good or bad to cast your opinion? You are going off on some random rant that makes zero sense.

Where do you see a 14bhp gain stated? So far all we have is before and after logs with zero tune changes. The oem pump struggles to maintain rail pressure where as the evo manages to maintain rail pressure.

Again load/boost, afr and iats will be the factors that stress the fuel system and itís capacity. I donít know why you mention timing, yes you need it for power but in here we are discussing the capacity of a fuel pump.

I agree here, XDI is still number 1. Iíd never consider PI as secondary controlled fuel systems arenít for me, DME controlled over any thing. I was close to pulling the trigger on a xdi-35 however held off after hearing whispers of other options coming to the table. Considering the same pump for the fords is cheaper the bmw tax they apply is joke.

The updated tune will most likely add load and the evo hpfp could take a massive dive...or it could handle it no problem. Until then we do not know.


M135i 8AT / JB4 + EWG Harness / N20 TMAP / VRSF 5" HD FMIC / Fuel-It TBI / Fuel-It STG2 LPFP / Pure High Flow Inlet / FTP Charge & Boost ***** / Richter ***** / Backbox delete / E50 Fuel / ngk 5992s / BBS CH-R's / KW V3 Coilovers / M4 LCA's / GP Front Splitter & Side Blades.
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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 03:29 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB90
Why so much anger and hate, it’s hilarious ��

Why not be open minded and wait for some solid results good or bad to cast your opinion? You are going off on some random rant that makes zero sense.

Where do you see a 14bhp gain stated? So far all we have is before and after logs with zero tune changes. The oem pump struggles to maintain rail pressure where as the evo manages to maintain rail pressure.

Again load/boost, afr and iats will be the factors that stress the fuel system and it’s capacity. I don’t know why you mention timing, yes you need it for power but in here we are discussing the capacity of a fuel pump.

I agree here, XDI is still number 1. I’d never consider PI as secondary controlled fuel systems aren’t for me, DME controlled over any thing. I was close to pulling the trigger on a xdi-35 however held off after hearing whispers of other options coming to the table. Considering the same pump for the fords is cheaper the bmw tax they apply is joke.

The updated tune will most likely add load and the evo hpfp could take a massive dive...or it could handle it no problem. Until then we do not know.
14 bhp. Guess I’m the only one willing to look at the data s:

EDIT: Had datalogs reversed. B58 HPFP actually made 14bhp LESS peak than stock

Funny how the entire first page is all about plug and play with no tune.

Now we are into tunes all of sudden when I questioned results.

And if you feel that is holding 2000 PSI, you haven’t looked at much data. That’s struggling to hold 2000 PSI.

The only thing hilarious is how people have already gone all in on this.

As I stated upfront in my first post, I admire the effort to improve. Some work, others do not. But the initial numbers show this isn’t much of anything and everyone is convinced it will come close to a XDI-35, when it’s not even close.

Last edited by IK6SPEED; 03-08-2019 at 08:38 PM..
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 03:41 PM

getting tired of this , but anyways , what i wrote before :
same tune different hpfp , check the rail pressures .
i wonder how far it will go with E20 . if i can get around 21 psi on E20
i would be happy with this upgrade .


now : if there are better products , yes but pls put your effort in such a thread and do not pollute mine with whatever info you might have that doesnt help anybody else


M135i PWG , FBO , PS2 , LPFP st2 , HDP6 custom for N55 , wedge MHD mapping , XHP AT8
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Endeav Endeav is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 03:43 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
getting tired of this , but anyways , what i wrote before :
same tune different hpfp , check the rail pressures .
i wonder how far it will go with E20 . if i can get around 21 psi on E20
i would be happy with this upgrade .


now : if there are better products , yes but pls put your effort in such a thread and do not pollute mine with whatever info you might have that doesnt help anybody else
Kind of odd all the flack you're getting. The difference between the two pumps when the requested rail pressure is 2000 is clearly evident in the logs you've posted. The reason you're not seeing higher pressures is because the tune isn't requesting it... I think the point being missed here by the other party is that your re-tune and future logs are going to "stress test" the pump in its ability to maintain a higher rail pressure under more load. As of right now we know that the pump is in fact stronger than the OEM pump. If the pump maintains higher pressures (if required) under more load or E20 fueling then we have some concrete data to say that the pump is MUCH stronger than the OEM. Again... I don't know why you're being heckled for the work you've done when the preliminary data is pointing us in the right direction.

Thanks again for all your work on this venture, and I look forward to the future results.


'17 BMW M2 - [DCT/N55] - PureTurbos Stage 2 Turbo - JB4 + MHD BEF - Fuel-It Methanol PI
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 03:47 PM

indeed only time will tell will how far it can be streched


M135i PWG , FBO , PS2 , LPFP st2 , HDP6 custom for N55 , wedge MHD mapping , XHP AT8
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DB90 DB90 is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 03:49 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by IK6SPEED
14 bhp. Guess Iím the only one willing to look at the data s:

Funny how the entire first page is all about plug and play with no tune.

Now we are into tunes all of sudden when I questioned results.

And if you feel that is holding 2000 PSI, you havenít looked at much data. Thatís struggling to hold 2000 PSI.

The only thing hilarious is how people have already gone all in on this.

As I stated upfront in my first post, I admire the effort to improve. Some work, others do not. But the initial numbers show this isnít much of anything and everyone is convinced it will come close to a XDI-35, when itís not even close.

You are very selective in the way you try and put your point across.

I presume you are referring to the 7psi post shift boost spike to 24psi, once boost is back on target rail pressure is solid. If you canít see that you havenít looked at much data.

The op states the pump needs no tune changes to run it. For example the xdi needs this due to the different frequency it runs on. Of course you would need a tune to take advantage of the larger pump no matter what brand it is.

We have 2 logs and some Bosch data on the fuel pump, thatís it. Again letís see the newest tune revision and the requested log situations that we know stress the oem pump to test this potential upgrade.


M135i 8AT / JB4 + EWG Harness / N20 TMAP / VRSF 5" HD FMIC / Fuel-It TBI / Fuel-It STG2 LPFP / Pure High Flow Inlet / FTP Charge & Boost ***** / Richter ***** / Backbox delete / E50 Fuel / ngk 5992s / BBS CH-R's / KW V3 Coilovers / M4 LCA's / GP Front Splitter & Side Blades.
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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 04:01 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
getting tired of this , but anyways , what i wrote before :
same tune different hpfp , check the rail pressures .
i wonder how far it will go with E20 . if i can get around 21 psi on E20
i would be happy with this upgrade .


now : if there are better products , yes but pls put your effort in such a thread and do not pollute mine with whatever info you might have that doesnt help anybody else
We all know what happens as Ethanol goes up with the stock pump. Or those in the know do.

Actually, I feel I am helping many more than you who are smart enough to see this play out instead of plunking down funds for a different OEM HPFP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DB90
You are very selective in the way you try and put your point across.

I presume you are referring to the 7psi post shift boost spike to 24psi, once boost is back on target rail pressure is solid. If you can’t see that you haven’t looked at much data.
Funny as I seem to be the only one looking at all the data.

EDIT: Had datalogs reversed. B58 HPFP actually made 14bhp LESS power than stock

Last edited by IK6SPEED; 03-08-2019 at 08:39 PM..
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 04:20 PM

did you really came all the way from bimmerpost to start a mess overhere ??
when is the first time you tried something out of the box on your car , took a risk of implementing , not sure about the outcome ?? i bet you do not have the guts to even try .

actually if i was you i should read the first line in the first post . Funny as you seem to be the only one reluctant to do so


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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 04:27 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
did you really came all the way from bimmerpost to start a mess overhere ??
when is the first time you tried something out of the box on your car , took a risk of implementing , not sure about the outcome ?? i bet you do not have the guts to even try .

actually if i was you i should read the first line in the first post . Funny as you seem to be the only one reluctant to do so
LOL

You lost that bet, as, we now are seeing, you do minimal research.

If you had done that you would have found I am clearly in the top 1% (and the top 1% of that) of people that have adapted other BMW stock parts to work in my cars.

Most have been successful. A few have not.

But thanks for playing.
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 04:34 PM

good for you but stop nagging about things that yet have to be seen .
as you would have done your research properly in this thread . you would have seen the words , testing with E20 and see what its capable of .
but thanks for your time


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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 04:42 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
good for you but stop nagging about things that yet have to be seen .
as you would have done your research properly in this thread . you would have seen the words , testing with E20 and see what its capable of .
but thanks for your time
*sigh*

I am the one posting about what’s actually been seen and not your pie in the sky speculation.

1) Does the B58 run A) Better B) Worse or C) The same as the N55 when Ethanol content is increased from 10%?

2) What happens on any stock BMW HPFP as Ethanol is increased?

You really need to understand the known basics if you hope to make any project a success.
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 04:46 PM

dude do you read this thread at all ?
i dont speculate anything
for the forth of fifth time already .
the evo pump holds just fine with the same map where as the oem one crashes . how far it can be streched has YET to be seen

really are you plain ignorant or what ???


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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 05:01 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
dude do you read this thread at all ?
i dont speculate anything
for the forth of fifth time already .
the evo pump holds just fine with the same map where as the oem one crashes . how far it can be streched has YET to be seen

really are you plain ignorant or what ???
I am the only one reading the data apparently, not the narrative of what others think.

If that makes me ignorant in your eyes, oh well....

I also see you avoided the simple questions I posed above which have a major impact on what you want.
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T_H_O_M_A_S T_H_O_M_A_S is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 05:15 PM

i'm gonna just ignore you from now on , do what you want in your own little world .


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Marlinman Marlinman is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 05:24 PM

Please don't let this distract you OP, keep going!


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IK6SPEED IK6SPEED is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 06:08 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by T_H_O_M_A_S
i'm gonna just ignore you from now on , do what you want in your own little world .
Considering you have ignored everything I’ve posted, based on facts, why am I not surprised.

EDIT: Had datalogs reversed. B58 HPFP actually made 14bhp LESS peak than stock

Enjoy your decreased 14bhp!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marlinman
Please don't let this distract you OP, keep going!
Please do!

So others do not!

Last edited by IK6SPEED; 03-08-2019 at 08:40 PM..
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N54-SHI N54-SHI is offline
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Default 03-05-2019, 07:54 PM

Thanks again for all your work on this venture, and I look forward to the future results.
Ignore the stubborn people!
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maxihari maxihari is offline
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Default 03-06-2019, 08:47 AM

Not even sure If I care about added HP, but rather ability to hold current power without fueling cuts and issues... hiccups and misfires.
Ability to flow more fuel... better flow under same load as current.


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