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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default Is my Pure stage 2 e60 ready for e85? is e30 a good starting point? - 11-21-2019, 09:09 PM

Hey all,

I recently posted a thread about my new build-

e60 AWD, Pure 600 turbos (stage 2), JB4 +BT, *********, inlets, outlets, BOV, FMIC, RB PCV.

MHD BEF - "PUMP"
JB4 map 5

anyway, I feel like the car is super solid, and I'm thinking about trying an e30 mix tomorrow after work. any thoughts/ opinions? techniques on mixing and things to look out for?

From the research I've done it seems like you can pretty much mix it and go as long as you're on map 5, and only up to e30 on the MHD Pump flash.
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THE BEAST THE BEAST is offline
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Default 11-21-2019, 09:14 PM

Make sure you log. Need to make sure fuel pumps can handle it. Also more ethanol, the higher your trims will climb.
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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-21-2019, 09:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BEAST
Make sure you log. Need to make sure fuel pumps can handle it. Also more ethanol, the higher your trims will climb.
fp_l is pretty stable at 65 at full load, and fp_h is right around 11 or 12 at full load.. from what I've heard that seems to be right around where i should be. anything else I can check?

also, could i try running like e20 or something first, and see how that goes?
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Default 11-21-2019, 09:32 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
fp_l is pretty stable at 65 at full load, and fp_h is right around 11 or 12 at full load.. from what I've heard that seems to be right around where i should be. anything else I can check?

also, could i try running like e20 or something first, and see how that goes?
Sure, thats fine. E30 , generally speaking is OK too , BUT, you are on hybrids. The more you push boost, the more fuel required. Your power level will be higher than someone on e30 and stock turbos. Your pressures WILL start dropping. So I suggest you log to avoid problems.
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Default 11-21-2019, 09:34 PM

I personally would start on say map 1, try e30, and evaluate trims, hpfp, lpfp, etc. Then make adjustments and go higher from there. I would not use map 5 to dial in hybrids. Thats just me though.
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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-21-2019, 10:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BEAST
I personally would start on say map 1, try e30, and evaluate trims, hpfp, lpfp, etc. Then make adjustments and go higher from there. I would not use map 5 to dial in hybrids. Thats just me though.
I'm only running about 14 psi of boost, and I see many people with stocks going higher, so I would think it would be comparable? also, I didnt know you can run e30 on map 1, I thought you had to run map 5 since it is auto tune.
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Default 11-22-2019, 10:46 AM

Im confused. You installed pure stg 2 to stay at 14 psi max ?
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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-22-2019, 11:01 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BEAST
Im confused. You installed pure stg 2 to stay at 14 psi max ?

No, I'd like to gradually increase my boost as I continue to log and understand the system more. But map 5 caps me off at 14.5, don't know why. I get more boost on map 2
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Default 11-22-2019, 11:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
No, I'd like to gradually increase my boost as I continue to log and understand the system more. But map 5 caps me off at 14.5, don't know why. I get more boost on map 2
Yeah, but how does timing look on map 2 compared to map 5 ? Any logs of map 2 to evaluate ?
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dmckmc dmckmc is offline
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Default 11-22-2019, 12:03 PM

For you to compare and note, I've a 535i with FBO and stock turbos, e85 BEF. I can use up to 45% ethanol before I start having fueling/fuel pump and/or timing issues. I can hardly stand to drive it without ethanol, it's a big difference in power!

I generally use map 5 all the time and routinely hit 19-20 lbs of boost. With stock turbos, the boost falls of quickly after 5500 rpm. Hopefully your upgraded turbos can support nice boost to red line.

Good luck and have fun bringing up the boost.


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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-22-2019, 12:42 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BEAST
Yeah, but how does timing look on map 2 compared to map 5 ? Any logs of map 2 to evaluate ?
Attached. It's done by weird **** in map 2, the boost seemed to be tracking much better in 5. Any tips on reading ignition data would be helpful for me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dmckmc
For you to compare and note, I've a 535i with FBO and stock turbos, e85 BEF. I can use up to 45% ethanol before I start having fueling/fuel pump and/or timing issues. I can hardly stand to drive it without ethanol, it's a big difference in power!

I generally use map 5 all the time and routinely hit 19-20 lbs of boost. With stock turbos, the boost falls of quickly after 5500 rpm. Hopefully your upgraded turbos can support nice boost to red line.

Good luck and have fun bringing up the boost.
Cool! Glad you are enjoying your 5er. I'm looking forward to tapping in to some of the potential of these turbos. You use the RACE bef or other?
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2019-11-22 07_21_43_Map-2.csv (5.0 KB, 10 views)

Last edited by inline6xi; 11-22-2019 at 12:47 PM..
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Default 11-22-2019, 01:15 PM

[QUOTE=inline6xi;651262]Attached. It's done by weird **** in map 2, the boost seemed to be tracking much better in 5. Any tips on reading ignition data would be helpful for me.
[/QUOTE
Enable 6 cyl timing to see all cylinders.
Log is short. 3rd gear, 2k to redline and make sure traction control is off. Already it looks like you could use more octane though. Definitely throw in a couple of gallons of E85 and go from there. Roughly 6 gallons of gas and 2 gallons of E85 gives roughly E30.
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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-22-2019, 01:46 PM

[QUOTE=THE BEAST;651264]
Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
Attached. It's done by weird **** in map 2, the boost seemed to be tracking much better in 5. Any tips on reading ignition data would be helpful for me.
[/QUOTE
Enable 6 cyl timing to see all cylinders.
Log is short. 3rd gear, 2k to redline and make sure traction control is off. Already it looks like you could use more octane though. Definitely throw in a couple of gallons of E85 and go from there. Roughly 6 gallons of gas and 2 gallons of E85 gives roughly E30.
I got some much better logs, although I didn't have 6 cyl timing enabled. I kind of figured that's what was holding me back given map 5 was only targeting about 14 psi.
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2019-11-22 12_19_40_Map-2.csv (9.2 KB, 10 views)
File Type: csv 2019-11-22 12_19_07_Map-2.csv (9.7 KB, 7 views)
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Default 11-22-2019, 02:29 PM

[QUOTE=inline6xi;651265]
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BEAST

I got some much better logs, although I didn't have 6 cyl timing enabled. I kind of figured that's what was holding me back given map 5 was only targeting about 14 psi.
Way too much boost for octane you are running. Be careful with that.
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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-22-2019, 03:35 PM

[QUOTE=THE BEAST;651267]
Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
Way too much boost for octane you are running. Be careful with that.
do you mind explaining what in the logs is telling you this?
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Default 11-22-2019, 03:37 PM

[QUOTE=inline6xi;651270]
Quote:
Originally Posted by THE BEAST

do you mind explaining what in the logs is telling you this?
Timing
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Roma_335i Roma_335i is offline
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Default 11-24-2019, 08:07 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
I'm only running about 14 psi of boost, and I see many people with stocks going higher, so I would think it would be comparable? also, I didnt know you can run e30 on map 1, I thought you had to run map 5 since it is auto tune.
I used to run 26psi on my stock turbos lol map 6 custom. Go for e30 and map 5, just get logs.
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Default 11-24-2019, 04:23 PM

Settings are wrong for Hybrids

Try following "ALL" Hybrid setup instructions and settings:
JB4 N54 Hybrid Turbo Setup Directions


As the beast stated earlier:
Enable 6 cyl timing logging - so you can see what all cylinders are doing
Start with a E30 mix - pay attention to your fp_h and fp_l at full load, also the avg_ign should start to drop: read this section in link bellow to help you understand what these numbers mean, VERY HELPFUL
Logging Parameters and their Meaning
do a few adaptation pulls before your actual log

do a proper log in Map 1 or 2: 3rd gear traction off 2k to redline

Post it in the Support Section


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Default 11-24-2019, 04:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roma_335i
I used to run 26psi on my stock turbos lol map 6 custom.
Id like to see some logs from that setup

26psi on stock snails


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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 10:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roma_335i
I used to run 26psi on my stock turbos lol map 6 custom. Go for e30 and map 5, just get logs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
Settings are wrong for Hybrids

Try following "ALL" Hybrid setup instructions and settings:
JB4 N54 Hybrid Turbo Setup Directions


As the beast stated earlier:
Enable 6 cyl timing logging - so you can see what all cylinders are doing
Start with a E30 mix - pay attention to your fp_h and fp_l at full load, also the avg_ign should start to drop: read this section in link bellow to help you understand what these numbers mean, VERY HELPFUL
Logging Parameters and their Meaning
do a few adaptation pulls before your actual log

do a proper log in Map 1 or 2: 3rd gear traction off 2k to redline

Post it in the Support Section

Thanks for feedback guys. I just drove up to the nearest E85 station, about 15 mins away.

Timing looks way better. car starting to feel like it should.

I ran map 5, boost was targeting over 17 psi. fp_h, and fp_l look good. lowest values were around 11 and 62, respectively.

You guys were right, I needed to run e85 to even be able to begin to start using some of the stage 2 turbo's capacity.

I may need to still get a clearer log in 3rd, 2k to redline, as these logs were done on hwy.

time for a 3.5 bar tmap sensor?

Attached Files
File Type: csv 3rd gear, higher rpm e30, MHD RACE, map 5.csv (4.8 KB, 5 views)
File Type: csv 2019-11-29 18_59_52_Map-5.csv (8.7 KB, 8 views)
File Type: csv 4th gear, e30, MHD RACE, map 5.csv (5.9 KB, 7 views)
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Default 11-30-2019, 05:01 PM

Did you even read the Hybrid setup section?


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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 11-30-2019, 05:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
Did you even read the Hybrid setup section?
yes, I read over it many times, in detail. What are you implying?
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Default 11-30-2019, 06:58 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
yes, I read over it many times, in detail. What are you implying?
your settings are wrong


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Default 11-30-2019, 07:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by inline6xi
yes, I read over it many times, in detail. What are you implying?
Double check your settings

Read the setup instructions again, Iím pretty sure it says to start with Map 2, but to each his own
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07 E90 AT - xHP
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inline6xi inline6xi is offline
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Default 12-02-2019, 06:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
Double check your settings

Read the setup instructions again, I’m pretty sure it says to start with Map 2, but to each his own
Thanks for clarifying.

you are correct, they recommend starting on map 2. I was a little bit confused as to how the system deals with changing to e30 mix from pump, so I thought it might be best to use the autotune map. However, it appears that the "AFR" that the jb4 displays is just lambda*14.7, feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, like I said this is all pretty new to me.

That being said, I threw the car in map 2 with an e30 mix and the car feels really solid. like big difference from pump.

I've attached some maps.

P.S. I still need to get the larger tmap sensor for when I want to increase my boost over 20.

P.P.S. another thing I was confused about was adjusting the duty bias. I was thinking this was only for map 6, but now I'm thinking maybe only the far left column "boost map 6" pertains to map 6 (???)
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Attached Files
File Type: csv 3RD GEAR, map 2, 5600 RPM.csv (4.8 KB, 7 views)
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