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Default 06-13-2017, 09:28 AM

Sorry for the drama just did not like being called stupid, all I've been wanting is a dead reliable twin turbo solution for a right price, don't care who makes it.

And thanks for correcting be, english is not my first language btw..
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ShocknAwe ShocknAwe is offline
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Default 06-13-2017, 11:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PLF
all I've been wanting is a dead reliable twin turbo solution for a right price, don't care who makes it.
You're not alone wanting a reliable twin. I'd love to see offers in the $2k range rather than the $3k+. The market looks like it's trending in that direction. However, you should care who makes it. Even with the most reliable option, failures still happen, and you need to know how it will be handled. I'm also uncomfortable with the distinct possibility that they will be advertised as "dead reliable" and then fail in less than 3k miles. Install and uninstall is damn expensive in both cost at a shop and time if DIYing, not even factoring vehicle down time while replacements are in transit.


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Torgus Torgus is offline
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Default 06-13-2017, 02:09 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by PLF
I've been wanting is a dead reliable twin turbo solution for a right price
It already exists, Mitsubishi makes them

What I find interesting is all of the stock frame upgrades claim to have added all of these better more robust parts yet they seem to have a much higher failure rate...

fast, reliable, inexpensive. pick 2.


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Default 06-14-2017, 05:45 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Torgus
It already exists, Mitsubishi makes them

What I find interesting is all of the stock frame upgrades claim to have added all of these better more robust parts yet they seem to have a much higher failure rate...

fast, reliable, inexpensive. pick 2.
You know, the longer this saga takes to unfold, the more inclined I am to pick up the OE Mitsubishi turbos from FCPEuro. That way I at least know that they'll replace them for free, and all I'd be out on is my own labor to remove/install a new set.
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Torgus Torgus is offline
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Default 06-14-2017, 07:58 AM

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Originally Posted by mrmax1984
You know, the longer this saga takes to unfold, the more inclined I am to pick up the OE Mitsubishi turbos from FCPEuro. That way I at least know that they'll replace them for free, and all I'd be out on is my own labor to remove/install a new set.
Beat the piss out of them and replace them for free. Hard to beat that deal and they price match(usually).


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TEC TEC is offline
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Default 06-15-2017, 05:42 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmax1984
You know, the longer this saga takes to unfold, the more inclined I am to pick up the OE Mitsubishi turbos from FCPEuro. That way I at least know that they'll replace them for free, and all I'd be out on is my own labor to remove/install a new set.
Would you rather he put something out on the street that has been endurance tested? Personally if it takes him another year to verify that I'm not going to spend money on some junk then so be it.
Crazy thing is people are jumping on him for not releasing the turbos fast enough but as soon as someone reports that theirs failed people will be dogging him for not testing them long enough...its a no-win situation.
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Default 06-15-2017, 05:58 AM

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Originally Posted by TEC
Would you rather he put something out on the street that has been endurance tested? Personally if it takes him another year to verify that I'm not going to spend money on some junk then so be it.
Crazy thing is people are jumping on him for not releasing the turbos fast enough but as soon as someone reports that theirs failed people will be dogging him for not testing them long enough...its a no-win situation.
My comment wasn't so much a dig at FT taking forever to get these out. I understand the realities of R&D, prototyping, and bringing a product to market. What is taking its toll on myself (and others, judging by the two threads), is the discussion surrounding the product. I hopped on to the e90post thread soon after he started it almost a year and a half ago. I was fascinated by his posts, since I didn't know anything about tuning or forced induction, and enjoyed reading about his trials and tribulations.

However, the conversation quickly diverged. FT continued to post his findings while ignoring commenters, and the commenters began their own debate about FT's reputation and methods. For the bystanders, it has become a very frustrating experience. On the one hand, we eagerly look towards every FT post about his developments, but then those are quickly followed by posts negating what has just been said. Those then are countered by posts backing up FT.

At this point I don't know who to believe anymore. It's very frustrating, as FT's product looks like it is shaping up to be fantastic at an excellent price-point. However, his lack of commentary/response leaves a bit of a vacuum in the thread, which is filled by 3rd parties.

I think FT is on the right track. I laud his decision to do all of his own research, instead of putting out a product and piggy-backing on other vendors' claims of performance gains. I'm just disappointed at how things are playing out in the threads.
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TEC TEC is offline
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Default 06-15-2017, 06:53 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmax1984
My comment wasn't so much a dig at FT taking forever to get these out. I understand the realities of R&D, prototyping, and bringing a product to market. What is taking its toll on myself (and others, judging by the two threads), is the discussion surrounding the product. I hopped on to the e90post thread soon after he started it almost a year and a half ago. I was fascinated by his posts, since I didn't know anything about tuning or forced induction, and enjoyed reading about his trials and tribulations.

However, the conversation quickly diverged. FT continued to post his findings while ignoring commenters, and the commenters began their own debate about FT's reputation and methods. For the bystanders, it has become a very frustrating experience. On the one hand, we eagerly look towards every FT post about his developments, but then those are quickly followed by posts negating what has just been said. Those then are countered by posts backing up FT.

At this point I don't know who to believe anymore. It's very frustrating, as FT's product looks like it is shaping up to be fantastic at an excellent price-point. However, his lack of commentary/response leaves a bit of a vacuum in the thread, which is filled by 3rd parties.

I think FT is on the right track. I laud his decision to do all of his own research, instead of putting out a product and piggy-backing on other vendors' claims of performance gains. I'm just disappointed at how things are playing out in the threads.
I totally agree. This is the reason I am reserving any judgment until the product has been released.
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fredcase fredcase is offline
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Default 06-15-2017, 12:17 PM

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Originally Posted by mrmax1984
I was fascinated by his posts, since I didn't know anything about tuning or forced induction, and enjoyed reading about his trials and tribulations.
These are the people he is targeting, and the the people buying his bs. Messed up, likley faked graphs that prove nothing.

Also, as stated before, he claims he re-balances these "in house" then, posts pics of a cradle balancer.

Good luck with these EVER becoming reliable.


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Default 06-22-2017, 05:50 AM

Since there's no movement on the threads, I figured I'll continue asking questions to try and learn stuff.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fredcase
Also, as stated before, he claims he re-balances these "in house" then, posts pics of a cradle balancer.

Good luck with these EVER becoming reliable.
What are you insinuating here? Is it that he's not actually rebalancing them, or that he's using the wrong equipment, or something else?

What about these being Chinese housings that he modifies and/or rebalances at his shop makes them inherently unreliable?

I'm not trying to challenge what you're saying, just asking for more details since I don't know the finer points of what's involved here.

[Edit] I've seen numerous claims that he has faked graphs before. Granted, his graphs suck as they don't have properly-labeled axis, relying instead on people understanding his descriptions. However, I don't think anyone in the 40 pages so far has linked to proof of graph-manipulation. If someone has this info, I'd be very interested in seeing it posted here.

Thanks!
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Tony@VargasTurboTech Tony@VargasTurboTech is offline
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Default 06-22-2017, 05:55 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmax1984
Since there's no movement on the threads, I figured I'll continue asking questions to try and learn stuff.



What are you insinuating here? Is it that he's not actually rebalancing them, or that he's using the wrong equipment, or something else?

What about these being Chinese housings that he modifies and/or rebalances at his shop makes them inherently unreliable?

I'm not trying to challenge what you're saying, just asking for more details since I don't know the finer points of what's involved here.

Thanks!
What he is saying here is you cannot rebalance an assembled CHRA on a cradle balancer. Balancing CHRA's on a cradle at all is bad news. We did it many many years ago, and the results were never consistent. If he cannot afford a high speed balancer, he should not be selling high performance turbochargers. But all this is moot, FT does nothing on these turbos. They are shipped to a turbo shop up in Oregon, they do everything, then Doug ships them under his name.


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Default 06-22-2017, 06:17 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony@VargasTurboTech
What he is saying here is you cannot rebalance an assembled CHRA on a cradle balancer. Balancing CHRA's on a cradle at all is bad news. We did it many many years ago, and the results were never consistent. If he cannot afford a high speed balancer, he should not be selling high performance turbochargers. But all this is moot, FT does nothing on these turbos. They are shipped to a turbo shop up in Oregon, they do everything, then Doug ships them under his name.
Thanks for the explanation Tony. Are you familiar with this particular shop in Oregon? I remember seeing some emails being shared in this thread between (I think) yourself and some other shop who had dealings with FT. Is this the same one? Do they at least know what they're doing?
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Default 06-22-2017, 06:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmax1984
Thanks for the explanation Tony. Are you familiar with this particular shop in Oregon? I remember seeing some emails being shared in this thread between (I think) yourself and some other shop who had dealings with FT. Is this the same one? Do they at least know what they're doing?
I am familiar with them, I had a couple calls with the owner that lasted about an hour each, about a 7 months ago. He did not tell me exactly what he does on these turbos, he did make it clear, everything he did was based on being as inexpensive as possible per Doug's instructions. I would highly doubt ANY rebalancing is going on. It would be easy to test, just send a CHRA to a company that has a high speed balancer, they can check the balance. Most all the Chinese turbo companies have high speed balancers these days, but to what extent to they balance is the question. In "spec", and getting down to next to no imbalance so they are more suited for high performance use are two different things.


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Default 06-22-2017, 06:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony@VargasTurboTech
I am familiar with them, I had a couple calls with the owner that lasted about an hour each, about a 7 months ago. He did not tell me exactly what he does on these turbos, he did make it clear, everything he did was based on being as inexpensive as possible per Doug's instructions. I would highly doubt ANY rebalancing is going on. It would be easy to test, just send a CHRA to a company that has a high speed balancer, they can check the balance. Most all the Chinese turbo companies have high speed balancers these days, but to what extent to they balance is the question. In "spec", and getting down to next to no imbalance so they are more suited for high performance use are two different things.
Wow, thanks for shedding this light on the situation. You've given me something to think about.

The price point of these "upgraded" turbos seemed very attractive, but I suppose it's probably too good to be true, especially with only a 2 year warranty. I think I'm now leaning back more towards getting new OEM Mitsubishi replacements.
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Default 06-22-2017, 06:40 AM

Just hang tight. We have our new Stage 2, and 2+'s available now at basically the same price point. 100% assembled in house, tripled balanced (wheels are factory balanced, we then component balance, then after assembly we high speed balance. We have shipped almost 20 sets in the past 2 weeks. I say hang tight, because even though they are available, we have a results thread coming, and a corresponding group buy, that will beat any pricing currently on the N54 market for turbos that can support 500-700WHP. Keep in mind these turbos are 100% brand new, not a single part is reused from a core N54 unit.


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Last edited by Tony@VargasTurboTech; 06-22-2017 at 06:57 AM..
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Default 06-22-2017, 06:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony@VargasTurboTech
Just hang tight. We have our new Stage 2, and 2+'s available now at basically the same price point. 100% assembled in house, tripled balanced (wheels are factory balanced, we then component balance, then after assembly we high speed balance. We have shipped almost 20 sets in the past 2 weeks. I say hang tight, because even thought they are available, we have a results thread coming, and a corresponding group buy, that will beat any pricing currently on the N54 market for turbos that can support 500-700WHP. Keep in mind these turbos are 100% brand new, not a single part is reused from a core N54 unit.
Oh wow, that's interesting news! Where should I look for updates, or should I just keep an eye out for the results thread on here?
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Default 06-22-2017, 06:56 AM

Even though I have little respect for Doug, and the way he does business, I won't cloud his thread up anymore. Just keep your eyes open, it wont be much longer til the group buy is announced.


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LazYME870 LazYME870 is offline
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Default 07-03-2017, 09:28 AM


Hello everyone, I've had a chance to be a beta tester for Frankenturbos and want to share some results with everyone here. I am basically FBO, with MMP inlets, running a Fuel It Stage 2 lpfp, stock exhaust, and JB4 with BEF tuned by Trebila. I hit the dyno and am very pleased with the results. Theres still a little bit of tuning that Trebila is still doing to fix some fueling issues, I am running E30 and I wanted to get results in without port injection in case some enthusiasts have no plans for port injection and wanted to see what kind of power these turbos will make without it. I will be getting port injection soon and turning up the boost some more, as of now if I go any higher than 22psi on my car, my HPFP takes a dive and I misfire. Port Injection should fix this problem, but for now the car is pretty fast and traction becomes any issue, will invest in an LSD to fix that. Overall I am very please with these turbos. here is the log of the dyno pull


I wont be responding to any negative comments, thats not what I'm here for. I just want people to know that progress is being made. We are still in beta, and I have seen the revisions Doug has been doing to his turbos to make them better and reliable before their released.
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2017-07-01 Dyno 522whp.csv (11.0 KB, 100 views)

Last edited by LazYME870; 07-03-2017 at 10:03 AM..
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TEC TEC is offline
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Default 07-03-2017, 09:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LazYME870
[IMG]
Hello everyone, I've had a chance to be a beta tester for Frankenturbos and want to share some results with everyone here. I am basically FBO, running a Fuel It Stage 2 lpfp, stock exhaust, and JB4 with BEF tuned by Trebila. I hit the dyno and am very pleased with the results. Theres still a little bit of tuning that Trebila is still doing to fix some fueling issues, I am running E30 and I wanted to get results in without port injection in case some enthusiasts have no plans for port injection and wanted to see what kind of power these turbos will make without it. I will be getting port injection soon and turning up the boost some more, as of now if I go any higher than 22psi on my car, my HPFP takes a dive and I misfire. Port Injection should fix this problem, but for now the car is pretty fast and traction becomes any issue, will invest in an LSD to fix that. Overall I am very please with these turbos. here is the log of the dyno pull



I wont be responding to any negative comments, thats not what I'm here for. I just want people to know that progress is being made. We are still in beta, and I have seen the revisions Doug has been doing to his turbos to make them better and reliable before their released.
Thanks for the info that things are progressing.

I'm interested to see your data logs. The numbers you provided are, not sure how to say this politely...unimpressive for an upgraded turbo. I pulled ~450hp/550lb/ft on a xdrive running e50 with stock turbos at 21 psi with a horrible tune. I was expecting that you would be making much more power with a protune and upgraded turbos.

I apologize in advance if this came off as offensive as that is not my intent. I want the turbos to be successful as much as anyone else. I'm just trying to understand why the numbers are so low.
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ShocknAwe ShocknAwe is offline
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Default 07-03-2017, 09:59 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LazYME870
Hello everyone, I've had a chance to be a beta tester for Frankenturbos and want to share some results with everyone here. I am basically FBO, running a Fuel It Stage 2 lpfp, stock exhaust, and JB4 with BEF tuned by Trebila. I hit the dyno and am very pleased with the results. Theres still a little bit of tuning that Trebila is still doing to fix some fueling issues, I am running E30 and I wanted to get results in without port injection in case some enthusiasts have no plans for port injection and wanted to see what kind of power these turbos will make without it. I will be getting port injection soon and turning up the boost some more, as of now if I go any higher than 22psi on my car, my HPFP takes a dive and I misfire. Port Injection should fix this problem, but for now the car is pretty fast and traction becomes any issue, will invest in an LSD to fix that. Overall I am very please with these turbos. here is the log of the dyno pull

http://www.***********/u/lazyxwizard...log=0&data=1-4

I wont be responding to any negative comments, thats not what I'm here for. I just want people to know that progress is being made. We are still in beta, and I have seen the revisions Doug has been doing to his turbos to make them better and reliable before their released.
Please post the .csv for the log! Also, are you using stock inlets? What is your specific part list?


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LazYME870 LazYME870 is offline
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Default 07-03-2017, 10:04 AM

Hi sorry I have mad edits to include the CSV file and MMP inlets to my original post. As for horsepower, I went as high as 24psi with these turbos but Ive has misfires from the HPFP not being able to keep up so i turned the boost down to 22 psi so that i dont run into misfire issues.

here are my mods
VRSF **
VRSF 7inch FMIC
BMS charge pipe, Tial BOV
DCI
MMP Inlets/ Stock outlets
Fuel it Stage 2 LPFP
JB4/ BEF flash by Trebila

If theres anything else anyone wants to know please feel free to ask

Last edited by LazYME870; 07-03-2017 at 10:15 AM..
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Default 07-03-2017, 01:30 PM

He is running E30. More fueling- > more ethanol -> more power.
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Default 07-03-2017, 07:11 PM

Clearly all the time that was taken to develop these turbos has paid off. These are light years beyond the competition.


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Default 07-03-2017, 07:52 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by TEC
Thanks for the info that things are progressing.

I'm interested to see your data logs. The numbers you provided are, not sure how to say this politely...unimpressive for an upgraded turbo. I pulled ~450hp/550lb/ft on a xdrive running e50 with stock turbos at 21 psi with a horrible tune. I was expecting that you would be making much more power with a protune and upgraded turbos.

I apologize in advance if this came off as offensive as that is not my intent. I want the turbos to be successful as much as anyone else. I'm just trying to understand why the numbers are so low.
Read what you quoted from LazYME870... he ran out of fuel supply and needs PI or supplementary fueling. 550lb/ft wheel torque sounds high for stock turbos did they correct it for gear/diff ratio? If you really made that much torque the torque must fall flat on its feet up top if you're only making 450hp.

Last edited by titium; 07-04-2017 at 04:37 AM..
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Default 07-04-2017, 06:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by titium
Read what you quoted from LazYME870... he ran out of fuel supply and needs PI or supplementary fueling. 550lb/ft wheel torque sounds high for stock turbos did they correct it for gear/diff ratio? If you really made that much torque the torque must fall flat on its feet up top if you're only making 450hp.
I think you need to go back and re-read what he said. He said he didn't want to put PI on yet because he wanted to get dyno numbers without these aids. He also stated that his HPFP is dying above 22pi. If you compare his dyno chart to others running e30-e50 at 22psi his dyno numbers are worse than what has been posted on stock turbos. There is another site that keeps up with dyno numbers, if you check there you will see what I mean.
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