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Default 328i BMS Stage1 vs. "BRAND X" Dyno Testing - 03-25-2015, 07:08 PM

Hey guys,

We've had customers emailing in asking about how our tunes compare with this brand or that brand, so we've decided to do a little in house testing just so we know where we stand. For this first comparison we wanted to see how our N20 Stage1 tune stacks up against other similar non-CANbus tunes.

To try to keep this comparison somewhat professional we're going to obscure the name of the tune we compared with and instead just refer to it as BRAND X.

Test vehicle: 2013 328i, automatic transmission, 100% stock, 38k miles, 93 octane fuel.

Tunes:

BMS Stage 1

This is the newer universal version of our Stage 1 system that has been shipping for the last six months or so.

This box has a 64mhz processor and four 10-bit DAC outputs, compared to the original system which was 8mhz with four 10-bit PWM outputs. Although technically superior there is no real change to the tuning end as the sample rate of both systems exceeds the rate of change of the sensors modified. The reason for the faster processor and true DAC was to make this board more universal. e.g. we're using the same Stage1 board for our new MINI & Mercedes applications. It also just so happens the faster processor is more readily available and less expensive.

In addition to a revised board the new universal Stage1 system features a new wiring harness which has been greatly simplified. It has TMAP & MAP connections only. Making for a cleaner and easier install. The Stage1 can datalog boost and adjust the boost profile using a DATA cable. This test was done on the default map 1 setting. For the 328i it runs a +4psi setting by default.

BRAND X:

This is a tune that is fairly new to the market, although versions of this tune with a different sticker on the box have been sold in Europe and Asia for several years. The harness has 4 connections. TMAP, MAP, RPM, and MAF. The RPM & MAF signals are completely pass through meaning they are being sampled only and not modified. TMAP & MAP are modified. There is a dial on the back of the box which you can use to adjust the aggressiveness of the boost profile. The manufacturer suggests using a setting of 6 or 7. During testing we ran it at each position and found setting 7 performed the best for this particular application. The manufacturer claims it's running at 64mhz although inside the box the circuit board has been potted with epoxy so it's not possible to verify. Again given the scope of the tuning involved with these non-CANbus analog signal tunes they could run at 1mhz and it wouldn't make a difference.

Testing procedure:

I started with BRAND X which was installed a day prior to arriving at the dyno and did around 15-20 runs under various configurations and settings, the best of which are shown in the chart. Then I removed the tune and did several stock runs, the best of which is shown. Finally I installed the BMS Stage1, did 5-6 runs, the best of which are shown. For both BRAND X and Stage1 I also did a short video of one of the pulls.


Results:

As expected, the tuners performed almost identically. The BRAND X tune had more of a tendency to cause boost oscillations in this particular pneumatic wastegate vehicle, although I expect it would not be the case on EWG vehicles. Pneumatic wastegate cars especially older ones are more prone to boost oscillations at higher midrange TMAP attenuation values. The air/fuel ratio was also a bit leaner overall with BRAND X also due to the slightly higher midrange TMAP attenuation values. But basically regardless of the setting used it performed on par with the BMS Stage1 tune using it's default settings. There is only so much a tune can do without CANbus & direct wastegate control so I can't say I'm surprised by the result.

Just as a subjective note I found the Stage1 tune to be much smoother under low and partial throttle operation. BRAND X has clearly been set to give a bit of a "wow" factor when tapping the gas pedal. You get much of the boost gain at a very low pedal input. I didn't care for it at all. But, since the Stage1 is programmable with the USB cable, we'll probably add a similar map to the device just so customers can experience that if so inclined.

Up next we'll be doing a similar test on a 320i (184hp) model.


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Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 03-25-2015, 11:51 PM

Much cheaper and more money in the pocket!


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 03-26-2015, 10:25 AM

Oh yes i know what this brand x is lol, they promised 37whp & they take case+ connectors water proof as an excuse for it's expensive price. I Had prob. with my st.1 connectors honestly but it wasn't from water it was from dust.. my setup now will not have any dust or water prob. in future. firetape+plugs+dielectric grease works wonders. beside I can't imagine if i had a problem with this brand x tune because of our fuel how would i adjust setting or even take a log ! BMS you guys rock )


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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-26-2015, 10:42 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyminded
Oh yes i know what this brand x is lol, they promised 37whp & they take case+ connectors water proof as an excuse for it's expensive price. I Had prob. with my st.1 connectors honestly but it wasn't from water it was from dust.. my setup now will not have any dust or water prob. in future. firetape+plugs+dielectric grease works wonders. beside I can't imagine if i had a problem with this brand x tune because of our fuel how would i adjust setting or even take a log ! BMS you guys rock )
TMC tune which uses speed-buster too.

hey guys can you guys test BMS Stage1 vs Racechip?
The racechip on N20 plugs into MAP, TMAP and MAF sensor.
I noticed at their stock setting matches BMS Stage1 numbers, keep increasing setting and it goes above.

Last edited by LycanX4M40i; 03-29-2015 at 01:47 PM..
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Default 03-26-2015, 11:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyminded
Oh yes i know what this brand x is lol, they promised 37whp & they take case+ connectors water proof as an excuse for it's expensive price. I Had prob. with my st.1 connectors honestly but it wasn't from water it was from dust.. my setup now will not have any dust or water prob. in future. firetape+plugs+dielectric grease works wonders. beside I can't imagine if i had a problem with this brand x tune because of our fuel how would i adjust setting or even take a log ! BMS you guys rock )
FWIW with the harness redesign we also redesigned the connector assembly process and included better seals. So no more issues there. We also have a new aluminum F series enclosure in the works that works with the existing system providing better weather protection in those situations where it's needed. More in that in a week or two.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 03-26-2015, 11:21 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobX3
LOL Triple A right?

hey guys can you guys test BMS Stage1 vs Racechip?
The racechip on N20 plugs into MAP, TMAP and MAF sensor.
I noticed at their stock setting matches BMS Stage1 numbers, keep increasing setting and it goes above.
Basically all of these analog only systems without CANbus control and without direct wastegate control can only attenuate the TMAP and MAP sensors to raise boost. And you can only attenuate them 4-5psi or so before you run in to check engine lights and problems.

So RaceChip, ESS, MHD, AA, AFE, TMC, Manhart, DTUK, chiptorque, and all of these analog only systems will produce basically identical results. If you want to send me a RaceChip box I'd be happy to install it and do the same dyno tests.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 03-28-2015, 12:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobX3
LOL Triple A right?

hey guys can you guys test BMS Stage1 vs Racechip?
The racechip on N20 plugs into MAP, TMAP and MAF sensor.
I noticed at their stock setting matches BMS Stage1 numbers, keep increasing setting and it goes above.
why don't you ship out your box for Terry, just for test purpose honestly racechip is the only company that I made contact with that said it can work with RON92 with their adjustment. so it kinda made me curious on my next tune for the X3, F10 ect.


F30 328i - 8 auto.. JB4+FF+EWG, OCC, Injen Intake+scoop, AFE **, AA axle-back - H&R springs, H&R rear SB - Front Strut - F&R BMS spacers..
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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-28-2015, 06:11 PM

Fully stock X3 w/ half tank of Valero 93 octane, xDrive + 4150lbs has bigger drivetrain loss than 328i.

Stock setting for Racechip N20 is C

1st run is baseline
2nd run on C
3rd run on F
4th run on 1
5th run on 4

The Racechip settings are from Lowest 8 to highest 7
8,9, A, B, C, D, E, F, 0, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7

I feel Racechip on F could of given a better number. Going back soon to install my ******** and do some more runs.
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Default 03-28-2015, 06:45 PM

Looks like some knock there with the high frequency wobble. Did you log ignition advance? Also must be ewg as those dyno a bit higher under higher settings on stage 1 tunes.

I see one issue. Set correction to std and smoothing to 5 so you can see the actual numbers.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-28-2015, 06:54 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
Looks like some knock there with the high frequency wobble. Did you log ignition advance?

I see one issue. Set correction to std and smoothing to 5 so you can see the actual numbers.
I will ask to get me the STD & Smoothing to 5 and the log ignition advance.

He did say he didn't like how it looked on 4th & 5th run at all, but that it might be different if i had supporting mods to help out things.
Yes this is a EWG 2014 model.

Last edited by LycanX4M40i; 03-28-2015 at 07:25 PM..
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Default 03-29-2015, 12:05 AM

Guys you are killing me, why are you using 93 I don't even have that fuel because it's at least 98 as ron (
the highest i can reach is 91 U.S
so Rob what setting you think you can reach before getting cel if you used 91, God this tune is strong. what's the boost btw on each setting so we can compare it. honestly it looks stronger than map1 st2. if it's same psi


F30 328i - 8 auto.. JB4+FF+EWG, OCC, Injen Intake+scoop, AFE **, AA axle-back - H&R springs, H&R rear SB - Front Strut - F&R BMS spacers..
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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-29-2015, 07:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyminded
Guys you are killing me, why are you using 93 I don't even have that fuel because it's at least 98 as ron (
the highest i can reach is 91 U.S
so Rob what setting you think you can reach before getting cel if you used 91, God this tune is strong. what's the boost btw on each setting so we can compare it. honestly it looks stronger than map1 st2. if it's same psi
My friend has 328i w/ down pipe & remus exhaust, he's going to Dyno with his JB4 and then put the RC on too. We didn't check for boost but I have checked myself I will update my first post with the info.
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rustyminded rustyminded is offline
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Default 03-29-2015, 08:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobX3
My friend has 328i w/ down pipe & remus exhaust, he's going to Dyno with his JB4 and then put the RC on too. We didn't check for boost but I have checked myself I will update my first post with the info.
Can you please do this forum a favor and try dyno with 91, it might be as powerful as JB4 but that's the main comparison for me because JB4 has an advantage of error read, map change, flap control ect. so I have to decide at almost same price if I'm getting more hp like 15-20 whp more at same quality fuel or more features because I will never ever use map 2 on the RON92 unless I get E85.


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Default 03-29-2015, 10:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyminded
Can you please do this forum a favor and try dyno with 91, it might be as powerful as JB4 but that's the main comparison for me because JB4 has an advantage of error read, map change, flap control ect. so I have to decide at almost same price if I'm getting more hp like 15-20 whp more at same quality fuel or more features because I will never ever use map 2 on the RON92 unless I get E85.
The RC is an analog box like our Stage1. For the most part anything you can do with the RC you can do with the Stage1. Neither will ever have the JB4 feature set, boost by gear, more robust safety systems, logging of timing, AFR, throttle, and other critical engine data, cold oil warmup protection, diagnostic code management, etc. I still don't understand why people try to compare CANbus based tunes with direct wastegate control to the simple analog tunes.

With a JB4 there is no limit on boost with the N20. It's just a matter of how your tuner wants to set it to balance performance and reliability. We pushed it up to 300whp for fun one day on the dyno.



Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 03-29-2015, 11:47 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
The RC is an analog box like our Stage1. For the most part anything you can do with the RC you can do with the Stage1. Neither will ever have the JB4 feature set, boost by gear, more robust safety systems, logging of timing, AFR, throttle, and other critical engine data, cold oil warmup protection, diagnostic code management, etc. I still don't understand why people try to compare CANbus based tunes with direct wastegate control to the simple analog tunes.

With a JB4 there is no limit on boost with the N20. It's just a matter of how your tuner wants to set it to balance performance and reliability. We pushed it up to 300whp for fun one day on the dyno.

ahh thanks for illustrating, Of course that's what setting JB4 & that's why I upgraded from first place but not everyone will use 93, E85 or even Meth kit but can you please explain why he got 277whp out of same 93 while on st.1 only 250whp on your dyno.. that's why for the test purpose Rob has to put E85 and test with 91 as well just for the viewers out here and people like me who live on the other part of planet . to be honest people questioned the quality esp. connectors but again they compared it for the price and it was a bargain but after redesigning connectors, seals & with alum. enclosure as you say at same price JB4 will end up on top, this time without questioning !


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Default 03-29-2015, 01:22 PM

FWIW on the topic of connectors, the connectors used on "BRAND X" are cheap Chinese knock offs of the actual connectors used and not especially high quality. We use authentic connectors from the same manufacturer that makes them for BMW. The issues with previous harnesses had to do with how the seals were not properly inserted during assembly. Wasn't a major issue. But, glad its sorted out now.

The new alum enclosure will be very nice but there is a cheaper solution available now: http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29548


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 03-29-2015, 02:09 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by RobX3
My friend has 328i w/ down pipe & remus exhaust, he's going to Dyno with his JB4 and then put the RC on too. We didn't check for boost but I have checked myself I will update my first post with the info.
The JB4 can run anywhere from factory boost up to 36psi, the maximum possible with the boost sensor, so the peak power output with the JB4 entirely depends on the settings used. The issue with the N20 motor is given the weaker rods how far do you want to push boost? 21psi? 23psi? 26psi? If a rod goes it's an expensive repair.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-29-2015, 02:21 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
The JB4 can run anywhere from factory boost up to 36psi, the maximum possible with the boost sensor, so the peak power output with the JB4 entirely depends on the settings used. The issue with the N20 motor is given the weaker rods how far do you want to push boost? 21psi? 23psi? 26psi? If a rod goes it's an expensive repair.
That is true, I haven't ran above 22psi stock without any mods.

At 21-22 range psi I had a lead of 1-2ft against the N55 X3 stock, same tires, same optioned car in a 0-65 we ran it 5x same results.
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Default 03-29-2015, 03:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
FWIW on the topic of connectors, the connectors used on "BRAND X" are cheap Chinese knock offs of the actual connectors used and not especially high quality. We use authentic connectors from the same manufacturer that makes them for BMW. The issues with previous harnesses had to do with how the seals were not properly inserted during assembly. Wasn't a major issue. But, glad its sorted out now.

The new alum enclosure will be very nice but there is a cheaper solution available now: http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29548
That's bad can't imagine how they would do in our area, the problem with the connectors I had that they didn't even have plug seals inside compared to stock ones, I'm glad you guys sorted that issue. I'll defiantly put that sleeve in cart along with extra posi-taps & JB4 key chain


F30 328i - 8 auto.. JB4+FF+EWG, OCC, Injen Intake+scoop, AFE **, AA axle-back - H&R springs, H&R rear SB - Front Strut - F&R BMS spacers..
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Default 03-29-2015, 03:15 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by rustyminded
That's bad can't imagine how they would do in our area, the problem with the connectors I had that they didn't even have plug seals inside compared to stock ones, I'm glad you guys sorted that issue. I'll defiantly put that sleeve in cart along with extra posi-taps & JB4 key chain
Yes in many cases the seals were omitted all together. In some cases seals were there but they were the wrong ones. Was an oversight that has been corrected.

The new seals we use can be retrofit to the older harnesses should anyone want some. To install them you'd extract each pin from the connector, push the seal over the crimped wire, and reinsert the pin.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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rustyminded rustyminded is offline
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Default 03-30-2015, 04:02 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
Yes in many cases the seals were omitted all together. In some cases seals were there but they were the wrong ones. Was an oversight that has been corrected.

The new seals we use can be retrofit to the older harnesses should anyone want some. To install them you'd extract each pin from the connector, push the seal over the crimped wire, and reinsert the pin.
Mine was beta st.1 based so maybe that's why, yes please. I'll contact you before the order as there is this company who will make order instead of me. I already opened connectors before but FF one looked like it was a trick so i left it.


F30 328i - 8 auto.. JB4+FF+EWG, OCC, Injen Intake+scoop, AFE **, AA axle-back - H&R springs, H&R rear SB - Front Strut - F&R BMS spacers..
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morkusyambo morkusyambo is offline
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Default 03-30-2015, 07:16 AM

thanks for clearing this up for us Terry. I assume the same build quality and functionality also applies to brand X's S55 box?
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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-31-2015, 11:31 AM

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Originally Posted by morkusyambo
thanks for clearing this up for us Terry. I assume the same build quality and functionality also applies to brand X's S55 box?
Brand X is actually TMC = http://www.tmcmotorsport.com/TuningB...?SID=445510944

But it looks like they have it for S55/M4
http://www.tmcmotorsport.com/EngineG...3398001782&a=2
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Terry @ BMS Terry @ BMS is offline
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Default 03-31-2015, 12:00 PM

For those wondering about the EWG vs. pneumatic here is an old Stage1 test done some time ago on a 100% stock EWG 328i. We'll test "BRAND X" on the same car down the road as well. And expect similar results.



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LycanX4M40i LycanX4M40i is offline
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Default 03-31-2015, 12:26 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
For those wondering about the EWG vs. pneumatic here is an old Stage1 test done some time ago on a 100% stock EWG 328i. We'll test "BRAND X" on the same car down the road as well. And expect similar results.

That makes sense, regards to what you mention that EWG seem to Dyno higher torque
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