N54Tech.com - International Turbo Racing Discussion
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default N55 speedtech vs bigboost vs ps2 - 11-15-2017, 06:15 AM

Peers,

I have installed both a PS2 and a speedtech kit, seem in depth install of the bigboost kit and tuned the s*** out of a ps2 kit. We are coming up to the holiday season and with 3 different great turbo options out here I wanted to provide some feedback for those who do not know the important but untowld differences. Ill start with the tried and true.

Pure stage 2: Ok, this has a cult following, for good reason.
2500+750+135+250~3635 (comparing to no core to keep apples to apples)
Pro:
- Plug and play bolt on
- Pretty reliable 500whp
- Dual seals on both sides. VERY reliable from a hydrid
- OEM look, near OEM spool
- Fits every platform
- Fits engine bay well (no need to move things)
Cons:
- Capped at say 550 whp. You can say more but im going to use average. This will require e85 or meth for octane and you will need 24-26 psi
- Restrictive stock turbofold. This puts stress on engine and on turbine wheel. Note: Pure has revised turbine wheel to much beefier one due to them shattering at high boost, only so much leverage you can get from a blade. The cult following has the few of these failures covered in haze and smoke

Overall you CANNOT go wrong with PS2. If you are happy, honestly happy, long term with 500whp then this is your option. Its reliable, can take a beating, good company, and you have a entire cult to join with you . There is a reason for it..... N55 is likely capped to 600-650 whp, and you could maybe get there with a PS2, but the engine will not be happy. I think you should limit safe use of PS2 to 500.

Bigboost: Wasnt sure about this kit until I saw it installed.
4000-5250 depending on turbo and BOV options
Pro:
- cast manifold (this may be a con for some).
- Turbo fits engine bay OK. Sits higher than speedtech, smaller frame turbo
- - FAR less pre turbo back pressure. Should correlate to better VE and happier engine (big pro in my book)
- DO not have to move water pump (I believe, didn't appear to need to)
- Provide hard lines for inlet, outlet, and coolant *****
- Coolant pipe design allows for "adjustments" to fit engine bay
- Should be able to hit 600whp with right turbo
- get to use a external BOV
Cons:
- Non preferred turbo. This is only one line but its a very important one
- manifold uses a gasket instead of the OEM nose + graphite ring
- pricey for the turbo
- slower spool compared to PS2 and speedtech
- Manifold is a heavy pita, so is engine mount, no concern for weight on this kit. Although I think reliability and fitment are likely more important
- coolant line has smaller ID, looks to be a good bit, this may or may not matter. As a engineer it concerns me, but if nobodies getting high temp warnings, may not matter.

Overall the bigboost kit looks good. comes from a actual company, the kit definitely fits a 135i. I have had a hard time getting ahold of them, there number does not work and its been days with no response via email. Fitment is good, hardware is good minus turbo, looks like a pretty solid options, wish it came with a better turbo, would make it a great kit. Turbo is the heart of the thing.

Speedtech: This was my choice for many reasons, but would like to update post install. I chose the speedtech kit because I thought the manifold was well sorted out but mainly because the EFR turbo. This things has a heart of gold, its a sexy amazing turbo in every way.
3800 no bov needed as its internal.
Note: the speedtech kit does not currently fit the e82 chassis. I believe I was the one to learn this. It also does not have a port for the DCT cooler. Speedtech has great customer service though and Jeff has been helpful and easy to get ahold of since day 1. I have shared all my lessons with him and would expect a e82 kit in 3-6 months. If you need to make one fit before then then email me and i can show you what I fabricated to make it work.
Pro:
- Best manifold: well through through manifold thats cast but lightish designed using CFD
- BY FAR BEST turbo: EFR has gamma Ti wheels, best casting methods, internal wastegate, GIANT bearings and dual seals. Its a beast. FOr this reason the center section and parts of comp/turbine are much larger than say a gtx or the bigboost turbo.
- PS2 spool (or better, time will tell)
- FAR less pre turbo back pressure. Should correlate to better VE and happier engine (big pro in my book)
- ******** and up pipe are well made
Cons:
- Tight: this thing barely fits, it fits, but barely.
- 4 ply silicone is used for all coolant piping and outlet pipe to IC. I think it works, but i prefer hard lines. its flexible so makes the install a bit easier, maybe
- Have to move water pump forward using provided mount
- does not fit e82 (currently)


All in all I have learned several things.
1. Use PS2 if you goals are 500whp or 450 on pump
2. drop the subframe. I did mine without, the bigboost was done dropping, way way easier
3. if you go bigboost or speedtech invest in some dei thermal tape and headerwrap and wrap everything, tight, then silicone spray. Dont install twice because of heat
4. On speedtech only
- move diverter valve solenoid, unbolt from turbo prior to putting it on. use longer hose and move it near coolant tank
- If speedtech in next 6 months you will need some aluminum tubing and fittings to make a hardline to go from water pump bend to up near block coolant inlet. This uses aluminum in the hottest parts vs 4ply. I think wrapped 4 ply would be ok also though, if this is what speedtech ends up doing.
- If going on e chassis make sure you have the right wastegate actuator rod length. The e82 has a longer one by about a inch compared to the f30, so you will have to cut it.

Ok I think thats about it. I still think, especially for the price, the speedtech kit is the only stage 3 I would go with. If bigboost updated its turbo then that might change depending on cost and how they did it. At the end of the day you are paying for the
- turbo
- manifold
- connection system

If you are a f chassis, or even a e90 (probably) then the speedtech is the choice. I would go speedtech even if my goals where 500, but thats just me. If you are e82 you will need bigboost or be ready to fabricate, unless speedtech comes up with a solution, which I am sure they will since its a relatively easy fix. If you are DCT you will be in same boat as e82.

Just some food for thought guys, I hope it helps make your decisions more justified.


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!

Last edited by jturboawd; 11-16-2017 at 07:48 AM..
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Jm276607@gmail.com Jm276607@gmail.com is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 06:33 AM

Great overview!!
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Juan_BIGBOOST_TURBO Juan_BIGBOOST_TURBO is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 06:57 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jturboawd
4750+500~5250 with bov
Hello Everyone,

Just for clarification:

Our 3.3, 3.2 and 3.1 kit includes a OEM DV coupler, while 3.4 includes a external larger BOV which is included in the 3980 USD Price.

Our phone is working ok as we have received and made calls on the last days, including yesterday. We even replied to your email yesterday.

The I.D. from the coolant pipe is perfect, it has been track tested and raced in a 2 hour endurance test without high water temps. There's no need to move the water pump.

We already have the design for a EFR turbo setup to be released by 2018.
Our spool RPMs is 3200-3500 on a 3.3 kit.

However our Master Power turbo is a very good unit, custom made for the N55 and B58. Our choice on using Master Power was because we wanted 100% reliability, they make everything in-house, keeping their quality standards. We have built over 8000 turbo kits using Master Power for factory new cars from manufacturers like KIA, Hyundai and Mitsubishi, we have had less than 1% warranties on the Master Power turbocharger unit, therefore making it our choice. Also we trust Master Power as they manufacture OEM turbochargers for MAHLE, which are even used on the new BMW engines.

Best regards,

Juan O.
BigBoost, LLC


Big Boost, designing world's most innovating and efficient turbo kits!
-----------------
BigBoost Instagram: @bigboostturbo
webpage: bigboostusa.com

BigBoost's car: BMW M240i
Stage 3.4 turbo
Current B58 record holder: Currently: 822 WHP
4.8 100-200
10.85 @ 135 1/4 mile


Daily Driver: BMW M235i
BBT stage 3.3 turbo


Garage Queen: 2014 Nissan GT-R
EcuTek ECM and TCM tune, BDM DumpPipes, BDM intakes, BDM full race exhaust, hybrid turbos, E85. 936 WHP
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 07:11 AM

Juan,

Thanks for the update. Lightning fast responses to feedback . Maybe I am getting slow responses nobody picking up phone because I am inquiring about just buying the coolant system. I tried calling for 3 days, went straight to "no voicemail has been set up". Just called and it rings and rings. You guys must just be busy. no email response or PM for cooling parts, but its only been a few days, not a knock.

All in all I think the bigboost feedback is good minus turbo. But I can buy a masterpro for 650 vs a efr for 2K there is a world of difference. If this was a drag car maybe I would not mind. LOVE that you are going EFR in 2018. Note: you are going to have to change coolant line passage, but I know you already know that since you guys work with the e82 so much. The coolant line is smaller ID, unless you have recently changed something. I literally just made one looking at yours, speedtechs, and the OEM one. Mine is a little smaller than stock also, but thicker wall, yours is thicker wall then OEM also, a tad. Its clean, not saying is a problem, just noticing a physical difference. I love your cooling pipe, **** I wanted to buy one, if you would pick up the phone or email me back. Had to make my own, issues being a inpatient redneck I suppose .

Master Power: this is a Brazilian garret knock off, parts often interchangeable. Actually a really good turbo for the cost. If this was a top mount and easy to get to and about 1200 or so cheaper then I would be game. but master power will have less spool and lower reliability compared to EFR. EFR has better QAQC better materials, better bearings, better seals, hence the 650 vs 2000 cost. Some of that you are paying for US manufacturing and better QAQC, much of it is for the specifications though. If this thing was not in the center of hell in the N55 engine bay then I would not care as much, but I would still care. EFR should out perform in spool, efficiency and reliability. Is it worth the added install time? IDK. to each his own. If I was building a turbo LS for the track I would use master power. There are several forums online that attempt to track the quality of master power (see one older one below). Seems the take away is they might be the best bang for buck, I just think its poor choice for bottom mount n55, unless its a drag car, for which well, might want to sell it and buy something you can put a LS in.

https://www.theturboforums.com/threa...l-poll.312244/


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!

Last edited by jturboawd; 11-15-2017 at 07:40 AM..
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Juan_BIGBOOST_TURBO Juan_BIGBOOST_TURBO is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 07:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jturboawd
Juan,

Thanks for the update. Lightning fast responses to feedback . Maybe I am getting slow responses nobody picking up phone because I am inquiring about just buying the coolant system. I tried calling for 3 days, went straight to "no voicemail has been set up". Just called and it rings and rings. You guys must just be busy. no email response or PM for cooling parts, but its only been a few days, not a knock.

All in all I think the bigboost feedback is good minus turbo. But I can buy a masterpro for 650 vs a efr for 2K there is a world of difference. If this was a drag car maybe I would not mind. LOVE that you are going EFR in 2018. Note: you are going to have to change coolant line passage, but I know you already know that since you guys work with the e82 so much. The coolant line is smaller ID, unless you have recently changed something. I literally just made one looking at yours, speedtechs, and the OEM one. Mine is a little smaller than stock also, but thicker wall, yours is thicker wall then OEM also, a tad. Its clean, not saying is a problem, just noticing a physical difference. I love your cooling pipe, **** I wanted to buy one, if you would pick up the phone or email me back. Had to make my own, issues being a inpatient redneck I suppose .
Anything else you need shoot me a text! Hope everything works well!


Big Boost, designing world's most innovating and efficient turbo kits!
-----------------
BigBoost Instagram: @bigboostturbo
webpage: bigboostusa.com

BigBoost's car: BMW M240i
Stage 3.4 turbo
Current B58 record holder: Currently: 822 WHP
4.8 100-200
10.85 @ 135 1/4 mile


Daily Driver: BMW M235i
BBT stage 3.3 turbo


Garage Queen: 2014 Nissan GT-R
EcuTek ECM and TCM tune, BDM DumpPipes, BDM intakes, BDM full race exhaust, hybrid turbos, E85. 936 WHP
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KevinC39 KevinC39 is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 10:15 AM

I've been eyeing that speed tech kit for awhile. I'm wondering what kind of 93oct, no meth, no PI numbers you could get out of it.

Thanks for the write up, OP. Great info!


E90 N55 RWD 6MT MHD Speedtech EFR7670 MFactory LSD
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Default 11-15-2017, 11:37 AM

Nice write up!

I ran PS2 for a while too and, I agree with you on that.

I bought Big Boost 3.4 Kit instead a few months back. Now, I'm waiting on the last piece to complete my built motor.

Which EFR turbo did you get?

It will be nice if we compare graphs (turbo spool, etc) later on.


2011 E92 ABR N55 Built Motor | ABR Built 6AT | Big Boost 3.4 Turbo Kit | JB4 + MHD | xPH Stg3 Flash | Fuel-It Stg 3 LPFP | Fuel-it PI Kit | COBB Exhaust | E85 |
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 11:53 AM

@ alexis: i got the 7670, which is the largest you can go with the EFR family bottom mount without dinging the frame rail. I laid the master power 3.3 compressor map atop the EFR and i think the 7670 is pretty much the more efficient version of the 6159 turbo, map has about the same peak mass flow but starts earlier and lives at a much higher pressure ration if needed. I will definitely share graphs and everything when im done. its a big build for me ill try to do a write up on it. I think the 3.4 will spool later, think 3.2 + a few hundred rpm. Since your auto that might be a good thing, keep that peak torque down and trans happy.

@ kevin I think the larger turbos will get you more power with lower octane for sure, but not sure how much, the compression ratio is so high on these that octane becomes critical really quick. I bet apples for apples the speedtech would out perform the PS2 at 93 octane by only 50 whp, but I bet it would do it at a few less psi also.


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 11:55 AM

another note: looks like bigboost just had a large price drop..... 3.1 starting at 3200. Not to shabby at all.


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!
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JETmn JETmn is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 12:57 PM

I am very excited to see your results of the Speetech kit. I agree with what you said in the OP, I have researched them myself. I have an old PS1 that I can use to trade in on a PS2, so I am going to do that. Now the decision becomes to sell the new PS2 without installing it and going with the speedtech or just roll with the PS2. Your results might help sway me :D
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Bimmer_Boost Bimmer_Boost is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 01:44 PM

I have not looked into big boost at all but if I was in the market for a new turbo I would have been interested in Speedtech. I am disappointed by the lack of information from both vendors. It is important to the customer to know around what to expect on pump, meth, E85, with both the stock fuel system and a modified one. With spool being an important factor I was surprised to see their dyno show 3,000 rpm. For me there is still not enough information to pull the trigger as a perspective buyer.

I was trying to steer Bours in the Speedtech direction but without more information I couldn't get behind the idea 100%.

I have owned the car for 4 years so I am only a year or two away from selling this car and moving on to something like the 6th gen camaro Zl1. It just doesn't make sense to pull off the Pure stage 2 and bolt on something else.


2011 E92 335i Auto
12.0 @ 125MPH JB4
11.7 @ 120MPH E30 MHD / 0-60 3.66
Sold

2014 E84 X1 35i 12.75 @ 107MPH / 0-60 4.55 / 293 AWHP 305 AWTQ When stock
VRSF Chargepipe | BMS Intake | JB4 ISO | N20 TMAP | VRSF 7" Intercooler | ER Turbo Outlet | XHP Stage 2 | BMS Methanol Injection |
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Bours Bours is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 03:00 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Boost
I have not looked into big boost at all but if I was in the market for a new turbo I would have been interested in Speedtech. I am disappointed by the lack of information from both vendors. It is important to the customer to know around what to expect on pump, meth, E85, with both the stock fuel system and a modified one. With spool being an important factor I was surprised to see their dyno show 3,000 rpm. For me there is still not enough information to pull the trigger as a perspective buyer.

I was trying to steer Bours in the Speedtech direction but without more information I couldn't get behind the idea 100%.

I have owned the car for 4 years so I am only a year or two away from selling this car and moving on to something like the 6th gen camaro Zl1. It just doesn't make sense to pull off the Pure stage 2 and bolt on something else.
After reading on forums for many many months i finally pulled the trigger on a ps2 !!

Id like to give you a shout out and also to everybody that answered tons of my repetitive questions about boost, power numbers, turbos etc....

Im gonna update once its installed and write a review


335i x-drive 2011 e90 n55

ER chargepipe | performance line d.p | 90/10 bms meth kit | K&N drop in | JB4 + MHD pump flash | xhp stage 3 flash | PURE STAGE 2 turbo

Last edited by Bours; 11-15-2017 at 03:06 PM..
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Default 11-15-2017, 07:42 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bours
After reading on forums for many many months i finally pulled the trigger on a ps2 !!

Id like to give you a shout out and also to everybody that answered tons of my repetitive questions about boost, power numbers, turbos etc....

Im gonna update once its installed and write a review
I just went pure on my car. Easy install nice and simple. It takes a lot of restraint to not floor it every time i see a straight away. Just gotta install my port injection and fine tune it then I'm set.


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Mods: ps2; cobb fmic; vrsf ⬇️pipe; phoenix racing cp; injen cai; pure inlet; fuel it stage 2 lpfp w/ sensor; jb4 w/mhd e85 bef; meth 90/10 do3 and do7 nozzles. n20 tmap. Alpina flash. Fuel it port injection e50
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 07:56 PM

Bimmerboost: yeah it doesn't make sense to do something like that if you're changing platforms soon. This is my 3rd 135i I'm a bit stuck and I've never been one to stay with a platform. I think this one will stay a while might get some clutch fenders if anything. Next build will be something with my kids that's off-road, maybe a fj or bronco in 2019. Next year I might garage queen the 1 and daily a old tr6 or something slow with soul.


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!
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maamaa007 maamaa007 is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 10:45 PM

Has anyone ported the manifold with a PS2?
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Default 11-15-2017, 10:50 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by maamaa007
Has anyone ported the manifold with a PS2?
The biggest restriction is where the individual cylinder exhaust runners bottleneck to feed the twin scroll turbo. I'm not sure you'd see any gains from porting the manifold.


2011 E92 335i Auto
12.0 @ 125MPH JB4
11.7 @ 120MPH E30 MHD / 0-60 3.66
Sold

2014 E84 X1 35i 12.75 @ 107MPH / 0-60 4.55 / 293 AWHP 305 AWTQ When stock
VRSF Chargepipe | BMS Intake | JB4 ISO | N20 TMAP | VRSF 7" Intercooler | ER Turbo Outlet | XHP Stage 2 | BMS Methanol Injection |

Last edited by Bimmer_Boost; 11-15-2017 at 11:08 PM..
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Default 11-15-2017, 11:01 PM

I think pure did some porting on the exhaust side housing but I'm not sure. It's probably not the best idea to port any further, manifold or exhaust runner wise, because you'll compromise the strength of the wall which could create potential issues. Theres probably not much metal left to allow for alot of porting either, but I'm not sure about that as I havent take a good look at the stock turbo fold, maybe jrturboawd could comment.

That's why imo I'm afraid to reslly max out PS2 because I'm personally worried about high back pressure from the turbos restriction + high boost = engine failure as it's alot of additional strain in the internals.


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135ilove 135ilove is offline
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Default 11-15-2017, 11:45 PM

I think Im the only one on here that has been running the 3.4 BB kit for months now. I have probably 100 logs on this turbo setup and have the turbo up to 27 psi. The kit spools and drives great and would love to compare spool with other turbo set ups.


2013 DCT Jet Black 135i
-JB4 Stage 2 ISO/w Flex Fuel Wires-Fuel it Stage 3 Bucketless LPFP-PDU Port Injection-Big Boost 6564 Bottom Mount Turbo Kit-Big Boost Chargepipe-Active Autowerke-BOV-Injen SP Intake with Blox Velocity Stack and Turbo Guard Filter-VRSF 7.5 in Stepped Race Intercooler--BMS OCC/OCV/CF-N20 TMAP-N20 Plugs-Motul 300v 5W-40-Archoil 9100-Motul Mocool-Custom 3.5 inch Straight Pipe Exhaust-Stoptech Rotors/Fluid-PFC Track Pads-VMR 710-Toyo R888r-M4 Flywheel- SSP R Clutches
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-16-2017, 05:30 AM

On the PS2. You cant port the restriction, its a thin wall clam design turbofold, the restriction is in the volute section, designed intentionally to spool the turbo early when flowing at 300 bhp . I am amazed at what we have done with the PS2 considering, its likely the perfect hybrid for the platform, but at some point the manifold becomes culprit.

@ 135ilove, you should post logs. Would be interesting to compare spool to the logs on the speedtech kit already posted by Jeff. I will do the same, in a month, when its done. Looks like we will have similar set up except my dct 135 will be speedtech and m4 intercooler and I plan to run some meth. Should be a good comparison. How are you liking those SSP's?


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!
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ozuna ozuna is offline
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Default 11-16-2017, 06:13 AM

Looking into purchasing a speed tech kit now that they are on sale. Would you recommend the 7670 kit or the 8374? The kit would go on a 2015 335i.
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-16-2017, 06:22 AM

@Ozuna: I would check with Jeff to see if anything needs to be adjusted to make the 8374 work on the f30, I know he has one on his right now. If I had a f30 I would go with the 8374 kit.


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!
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serenvox serenvox is offline
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Default 11-16-2017, 06:41 AM

Anyone know is the speedtech kit will fit on an F22 M235XI? I'm in the market right now to go with a kit and th8s forum is just what I needed to get an idea of what I want. Not so interested in PS2 as my goal is a reliable 550 all wheel. I have fuel it PI and the stg3 lpfp ready to go. Just need to find a kit
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jturboawd jturboawd is offline
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Default 11-16-2017, 07:00 AM

so F22 + AWD i think would be a experiment with either kit. you would have to reach out to Jeff and Juan to see if they have looked at it. I bet the turbo would fit, but you might end up doing fab work to make some of the piping work. So if you are paying someone make sure they can work with aluminum and save some money for the fab and you might end up with the first .


2012 N55 135I, Speedtech 7670, JB4 + MHD, Fuel-it port injection & stage 3 LPFP, M4 A2W IC, Mfactory LSD, KW V1, Apex EC-7, Most importantly CF Roof!
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Default 11-16-2017, 07:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by jturboawd
so F22 + AWD i think would be a experiment with either kit. you would have to reach out to Jeff and Juan to see if they have looked at it. I bet the turbo would fit, but you might end up doing fab work to make some of the piping work. So if you are paying someone make sure they can work with aluminum and save some money for the fab and you might end up with the first .
Our kit fits M235I F22 with XDrive


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Default 11-16-2017, 07:39 AM

@ serenvox there you go, and its on sale for 3800 now. I would reach out to jeff and see if his kit fits or would likely fit. If he doesnt know then it becomes a master power vs efr and fab question. I bet the 3.3 kit would work out well.

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