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ddnspider ddnspider is offline
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Default 11-26-2019, 09:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.moosh
Hey Terry(or anyone ) how do these logs look. Running 91+e85 for E30.
Your AFR's are WAY too lean, but it's likely not pulling a bunch of timing because its E85 thankfully. Fuel trims are maxxed and can't account for the added Ethanol content. I don't recommend what you're doing at all.


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Default 11-26-2019, 09:42 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ddnspider
Your AFR's are WAY too lean, but it's likely not pulling a bunch of timing because its E85 thankfully. Fuel trims are maxxed and can't account for the added Ethanol content. I don't recommend what you're doing at all.
@Mr.Moosh I had the same results when running e30. If you decide to run E, I recommend keeping it below an e20 blend on stock pumps, e23 max


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423 whp, 450 tq at 16.8psi with E30/JB4/FW/Intakes
12.64 @114mph
0-60 4.46
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Default 11-26-2019, 10:00 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.moosh
Hey Terry(or anyone ) how do these logs look. Running 91+e85 for E30.
I would say requesting +9 is too much (I tried as well) and agree that although the timing is holding well and it probably feels great it is too lean. You are barely reaching 12.5 by redline with maxed trims. You need to back the boost down a pound or two and be careful with how much ethanol you are actually running. You may have done some calculations and believe its e30 but with out actually testing it you could be off by quite a bit. I would not run more boost then you can on e20 to stay within the tolerances of the fuel system. If you get a hpfp and lpfp upgrade and a tune along with it then you can shoot for the moon.


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Default 11-26-2019, 10:11 AM

Another FYI, the last member that went +9 because he thought MS109 made his car bulletproof went thru 2 engines and 4 turbos


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423 whp, 450 tq at 16.8psi with E30/JB4/FW/Intakes
12.64 @114mph
0-60 4.46
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Default 11-26-2019, 10:16 AM

God damn, well understood hahaha. Thanks guys. I'll add 2-3 gal of 91 today and lower the boost to +8 and repost.

Also, I did test the e85 station I use, ends up being e75 so I mixed 4gal E to 11 gal 91 for E28.


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Default 11-26-2019, 10:28 AM

Can I see your Map6 settings? +8 is also still too high IMO. After +7 on this platform, there's a lot of variables in play


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423 whp, 450 tq at 16.8psi with E30/JB4/FW/Intakes
12.64 @114mph
0-60 4.46
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Default 11-26-2019, 10:47 AM

It certainly is playing on the razors edge at +7-8. You have no safety margin for a tank of ****ty 91 or a loaded car, extended pull into 5th gear, etc. I would leave the +7 or +8 as a kill map when you can add a little octane booster for extra safety margin and run a +5-6 map as your everyday map.


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Default 11-26-2019, 11:49 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.moosh
Hey Terry(or anyone ) how do these logs look. Running 91+e85 for E30.
Little lean for my taste too, adding a few gallons of 91 to bring the mix down makes sense.


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Default 11-26-2019, 01:01 PM

Gotcha! Thanks guys! Gonna turn down the boost to +6-7 and already added 2gal.

My map 6 is as follows

1500: 2
2000: 3
2500: 4
3000: 5
3500:6
4000:8
4500: 8
5000 : 8
5500 : 8
6000: 7
6500: 3
7000: 0

Default Wastegate pos: 20
1st limiter: 5


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maustro maustro is offline
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Default 11-26-2019, 04:16 PM

Hi Terry / All,

I just installed my jb4 after having jb1 for several months on my red sport. Would anyone mind taking a look at my logs?

If you can make any recommendations to increase/decrease boost in my
Map 6, I would appreciate it!

- 91 octane in Los Angeles
- weather was low to mid 60ís
- bms intake with inlets
- both logs are 3rd gear pulls
- Map 6 as follows:
1500: 0
2000: 1
2500: 2
3000: 3
3500: 4
4000: 4
4500: 3.5
5000: 3
5500: 1
6000 - 7000: 0

Thanks!
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2019-11-26 13_51_43_Map-6.csv (7.1 KB, 191 views)
File Type: csv 2019-11-26 13_53_05_Map-6.csv (5.1 KB, 186 views)


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(#4911)
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Terry @ BMS's Avatar
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Default 11-26-2019, 09:09 PM

For those running the BMS intake and inlets with bracket issues, we've got some new prototypes for testing. Drop me an email if you have time to pop them on in the next few days to confirm fitment.
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Default 11-27-2019, 09:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.moosh
Gotcha! Thanks guys! Gonna turn down the boost to +6-7 and already added 2gal.

My map 6 is as follows

1500: 2
2000: 3
2500: 4
3000: 5
3500:6
4000:8
4500: 8
5000 : 8
5500 : 8
6000: 7
6500: 3
7000: 0

Default Wastegate pos: 20
1st limiter: 5
This is definitely a kill map, and you're greatly decreasing the shelf life of your turbos. Take some time and read this article: TO INFINITI BEYOND - ANALYZING THE VR30DDTT TURBOS | STILLEN Garage

You're way outside of the efficiency zone of these small turbos in a few spots on the RPM band. +7 at 6000RPM is just generating heat and hurting the turbos. The objective is to get the most efficiency out of these turbos, not push them hard to force them into performance. Requesting too much boost down low or up high is just creating problems. Here's my map 6 for reference, and I have access to 93 octane and e85 that tests at 85 (I stopped using E altogether).



Default wastegate position doesn't do anything on this platform as an fyi


2019 Q50 Luxe RWD *JB4 with Bluetooth, Fuel Wires & EWG Connectors*BMS Intakes*AMS Downers*Frozen Boost 101*Megan Y Pipe*ADD W1 Oil Catch Can*HKS BOVs*275/40/19 Firehawk Indy 500s*
423 whp, 450 tq at 16.8psi with E30/JB4/FW/Intakes
12.64 @114mph
0-60 4.46

Last edited by Serstylz2; 11-27-2019 at 09:26 AM..
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Lonmon Lonmon is offline
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Default 11-27-2019, 09:23 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by maustro
Hi Terry / All,

I just installed my jb4 after having jb1 for several months on my red sport. Would anyone mind taking a look at my logs?

If you can make any recommendations to increase/decrease boost in my
Map 6, I would appreciate it!

- 91 octane in Los Angeles
- weather was low to mid 60ís
- bms intake with inlets
- both logs are 3rd gear pulls
- Map 6 as follows:
1500: 0
2000: 1
2500: 2
3000: 3
3500: 4
4000: 4
4500: 3.5
5000: 3
5500: 1
6000 - 7000: 0

Thanks!
I think your logs look good. I wish you had better fuel around as the 91 octane is your limiting factor. Timing does not take any dives but overall it is pretty low. I'm sure the RS cars have lower timing from the factory since they run more boost stock and the fuel isn't helping either. I would not go any higher with the boost on that fuel. Personally I do think fuel wires would help a little with the rich conditions at the top of the rpm band and may see some power increase there. I will say that there is at least one knowledgeable member here that feels that the target afr with fuel wires is a little too lean using 91 at higher then stock boost levels. (in the interest of well rounded advice)


2020 BMW M340ix Portimao Blue
K&N drop in, JB+, Intake muffler delete

2016 Q50 Premium 3.0t AWD (GONE)
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E20ish mix made 413whp 410wtq (17-18psi peak)
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Mr.moosh Mr.moosh is offline
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Default 11-27-2019, 09:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serstylz2
This is definitely a kill map, and you're greatly decreasing the shelf life of your turbos. Take some time and read this article: TO INFINITI BEYOND - ANALYZING THE VR30DDTT TURBOS | STILLEN Garage

You're way outside of the efficiency zone of these small turbos in a few spots on the RPM band. +7 at 6000RPM is just generating heat and hurting the turbos. The objective is to get the most efficiency out of these turbos, not push them hard to force them into performance. Requesting too much boost down low or up high is just creating problems. Here's my map 6 for reference, and I have access to 93 octane and e85 that tests at 85 (I stopped using E altogether).



Default wastegate position doesn't do anything on this platform as an fyi

I did read that article by stillen and then did a log on map 0 to get stock boost targets at each rpm and match that but my run probably was off and gave me some bad numbers. Anyways, I'll probably be switching over to your map and datalogging later on with E20 from now on. Thanks bro!


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(#4915)
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maustro maustro is offline
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Default 11-27-2019, 09:59 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lonmon
I think your logs look good. I wish you had better fuel around as the 91 octane is your limiting factor. Timing does not take any dives but overall it is pretty low. I'm sure the RS cars have lower timing from the factory since they run more boost stock and the fuel isn't helping either. I would not go any higher with the boost on that fuel. Personally I do think fuel wires would help a little with the rich conditions at the top of the rpm band and may see some power increase there. I will say that there is at least one knowledgeable member here that feels that the target afr with fuel wires is a little too lean using 91 at higher then stock boost levels. (in the interest of well rounded advice)

Thanks for checking out my logs. Terry mentioned I wouldnít need fuel wires on 91, so I decided not to get those. Iíll log again when temps get hotter to make sure things are running smoothly.


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Lonmon Lonmon is offline
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Default 11-27-2019, 12:23 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Serstylz2
This is definitely a kill map, and you're greatly decreasing the shelf life of your turbos. Take some time and read this article: TO INFINITI BEYOND - ANALYZING THE VR30DDTT TURBOS | STILLEN Garage

You're way outside of the efficiency zone of these small turbos in a few spots on the RPM band. +7 at 6000RPM is just generating heat and hurting the turbos. The objective is to get the most efficiency out of these turbos, not push them hard to force them into performance. Requesting too much boost down low or up high is just creating problems. Here's my map 6 for reference, and I have access to 93 octane and e85 that tests at 85 (I stopped using E altogether).



Default wastegate position doesn't do anything on this platform as an fyi
I agree with most of what you said and I believe your map is pretty much the perfect max map for a non RS on 93 octane. I would point out that the factory ecu does not always request 10psi and even with him requesting more boost then your map does, that does not often end up with greater then 17psi. Even when requesting +8 up top (over 5k rpm) the ecu won't achieve more then around 15psi as you get closer to redline. I'm not so sure that requesting up to +7 or 8 at any given rpm is "way out of the turbos efficiency range". Now thats not to say that its a good idea to do, just that it may be bad for a different reason. The reason I believe it is not good to request too much before or after 4k-5.5k is more to do with the way the JB4 works in intercepting and modifying the map signal to the factory ecu. If you change those numbers too abruptly the ecu appears to recognize that and fight what we are trying to do. So if you start adding boost too aggressively you will feel the surging feeling as boost comes on as the ecu fights what you are requesting. I have not seen this at the top of the rpm band but the limitations of the fuel system and the overworking of the turbo trying to maintain above 15psi on these small turbos at or near redline is why I would not recommend too aggressive after 5500rpm as well. I will also note that Garrett turbos in of themselves don't have the best track record of holding up well for the long haul. The early DSM (Mitsubishi) cars pre 1995 had mitsubishi turbos and held up very well, then in 1995 the 2nd gen Eclipse went to the Garrett T25. What a piece of crap that turbo was, another example of a 50k miles if your lucky hot air blower. Everyone switched over to a mitsu 16g as soon as they could (or when their t25 blew up) and had much better reliability and power after. What I'm getting at is that while overspinning any turbo can shorten lifespan, I believe the poor quality of these turbos is way more a factor then running a pound or two out of its efficiency range. There are plenty of stock guys with turbo problems with this platform. To each his own, play it safe and run less then 17psi hoping the turbos will last a long time, or run the max you can get away with on the fuel you are running or tune will support (ex AMS pushing 20psi) and see how long it holds. Most likely we will all be putting turbos on these things eventually if you have them long enough. The question after that is just if you kept it stock enough to cover it under warranty, or if you didn't give a fudge because you would rather replace it with something better anyway.


2020 BMW M340ix Portimao Blue
K&N drop in, JB+, Intake muffler delete

2016 Q50 Premium 3.0t AWD (GONE)
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Megan Racing Lowers
Megan Racing Y p!p3
BMS Heat Exchanger
JB4 W/fuel wires Map 6 custom
E20ish mix made 413whp 410wtq (17-18psi peak)

Last edited by Lonmon; 11-28-2019 at 06:49 AM..
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(#4917)
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19_Q50RS 19_Q50RS is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 02:43 PM

Hey terry I had this issue this morning when I started up the car the car was in a limp mode I had no check engine light... current have intake/exhaust/lower do and jb4
Attached Files
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Default 11-29-2019, 02:58 PM

Have you used the JB4 app to read any codes? May sound obvious but does removing the JB4 harness and returning wiring to stock resolve the limp mode? The harness pins can be troublesome and reseating it has worked for folks.


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19_Q50RS 19_Q50RS is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 03:07 PM

No didn’t try to read the codes because I was on my way to work and already running late... so removing the jb4 and running stock for a while is what your suggesting?
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Default 11-29-2019, 03:22 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 19_Q50RS
No didnít try to read the codes because I was on my way to work and already running late... so removing the jb4 and running stock for a while is what your suggesting?
Pulling the JB4 takes some effort so I would start with reading any codes 1st.


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19_Q50RS 19_Q50RS is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 03:40 PM

Might have to try that... but I did notice someone else is having the same issue on the Facebook group and he’s stock
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19_Q50RS 19_Q50RS is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 08:34 PM

Got the CEL P0012 and P0022
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Default 11-29-2019, 08:51 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 19_Q50RS
Got the CEL P0012 and P0022
Above my knowledge but a Google search says those codes are Bank 1 & Bank 2 timing issue... the JB4 can clear those errors as well. Have you tried clearing the codes and seeing if the engine returns to normal?


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19_Q50RS 19_Q50RS is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 09:36 PM

Cleared them but the car still feels sluggish I do get more power than this morning but still doesn’t feel like it’s where it should be. I have disconnected the battery completely and will find out tomorrow when I connect it again and take it out for a test drive
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Default 11-30-2019, 10:18 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 19_Q50RS
Cleared them but the car still feels sluggish I do get more power than this morning but still doesnít feel like itís where it should be. I have disconnected the battery completely and will find out tomorrow when I connect it again and take it out for a test drive
Codes indicate something with the timing/valve system so doesn't seem to be tuning related.


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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