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Hermanlo Hermanlo is offline
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Default 10-03-2019, 06:48 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ezatnova
Also on map 0? 16 is very high for no tune.
Unfortunately I didn't get to log the car in Map 0. But I thought that was stock boost pressure for a C63S? In fact a quick Google search shows motortrend saying the C63 has a stock boost pressure of 16PSI while a C63S makes 17.4PSI stock boost. Also, before I had a chance to log the car I had the car misfire and go into limp mode. Same thing, JB4 showed no error codes and I had to pull over to restart the engine.

Attached a Map 2 log. No boost pressure increase whatsoever and car power is same as before JB4 install.
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File Type: csv 2019-10-03 20_44_03_Map-2.csv (3.4 KB, 6 views)
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Default 10-03-2019, 07:54 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermanlo
Unfortunately I didn't get to log the car in Map 0. But I thought that was stock boost pressure for a C63S? In fact a quick Google search shows motortrend saying the C63 has a stock boost pressure of 16PSI while a C63S makes 17.4PSI stock boost. Also, before I had a chance to log the car I had the car misfire and go into limp mode. Same thing, JB4 showed no error codes and I had to pull over to restart the engine.

Attached a Map 2 log. No boost pressure increase whatsoever and car power is same as before JB4 install.
Ugh, more misfire issues. What map was that misfire on? Mine did it on 2 but hiccups on 1 too

My understanding regarding boost was coming from looking at my logs where it said actual boost was 14-16 on the tuned maps while it said ECU boost was 9-12. I assumed the ECU boost was what the car produced untuned.

Regardless, you should feel a pretty blatant difference between 0 and 2 and even 0 and 1.

Your log is extremely short, but still you can see the delta between ECU PSI and Boost is ~5, which is correct. It is doing something.

I would log map 0 and the compare that with the one you posted here

On my Map 0 logs, ECU PSI and Boost are basically identical (with Boost being 4-6 less on map 0 than when on map 1 or 2)

Last edited by ezatnova; 10-03-2019 at 08:45 AM..
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Default 10-03-2019, 09:55 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermanlo
Unfortunately I didn't get to log the car in Map 0. But I thought that was stock boost pressure for a C63S? In fact a quick Google search shows motortrend saying the C63 has a stock boost pressure of 16PSI while a C63S makes 17.4PSI stock boost. Also, before I had a chance to log the car I had the car misfire and go into limp mode. Same thing, JB4 showed no error codes and I had to pull over to restart the engine.

Attached a Map 2 log. No boost pressure increase whatsoever and car power is same as before JB4 install.
Log is literally 2 seconds log so that is too short to see anything. Grab a longer run on map0 and map1 for comparison.


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Hermanlo Hermanlo is offline
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Default 10-03-2019, 10:39 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ezatnova
Ugh, more misfire issues. What map was that misfire on? Mine did it on 2 but hiccups on 1 too

My understanding regarding boost was coming from looking at my logs where it said actual boost was 14-16 on the tuned maps while it said ECU boost was 9-12. I assumed the ECU boost was what the car produced untuned.

Regardless, you should feel a pretty blatant difference between 0 and 2 and even 0 and 1.

Your log is extremely short, but still you can see the delta between ECU PSI and Boost is ~5, which is correct. It is doing something.

I would log map 0 and the compare that with the one you posted here

On my Map 0 logs, ECU PSI and Boost are basically identical (with Boost being 4-6 less on map 0 than when on map 1 or 2)
Misfirings happened on Map 2. I did a pull from 2nd to 4th WOT and bam, misfire, cel and limp mode.

Gonna try and do a Map 0 and Map 2 4th Gear log tomorrow and post it up. Terry has replied me via email so will post any updates here
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ezatnova ezatnova is offline
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Default 10-03-2019, 11:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermanlo
Misfirings happened on Map 2. I did a pull from 2nd to 4th WOT and bam, misfire, cel and limp mode.

Gonna try and do a Map 0 and Map 2 4th Gear log tomorrow and post it up. Terry has replied me via email so will post any updates here
Not that it matters a ton, but what cylinders misfired? Just asking since another user I know also had 7 and 8 do it just like mine. If yours is 7 and 8 too, it would be interesting
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Hermanlo Hermanlo is offline
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Default 10-03-2019, 06:48 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ezatnova
Not that it matters a ton, but what cylinders misfired? Just asking since another user I know also had 7 and 8 do it just like mine. If yours is 7 and 8 too, it would be interesting
Happened late last night on the way home when a Lexus ISF tried to race me. Obviously I was pulling away from him when this happened

JB4 didn't show any error codes so I pulled over to restart engine. Will head back to my workshop to do a scan and see what pops out.
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ezatnova ezatnova is offline
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Default 10-03-2019, 06:55 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermanlo
Happened late last night on the way home when a Lexus ISF tried to race me. Obviously I was pulling away from him when this happened

JB4 didn't show any error codes so I pulled over to restart engine. Will head back to my workshop to do a scan and see what pops out.
I know the feeling. I was going at it with a well tuned M2 competition and then WHAM. 16 mph for me and 138mph for him. He came back to the pits later and asked where the hell I went lol.
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Default 10-04-2019, 09:34 PM

Is factory boost really as high as 16 to 17PSI?


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Default 10-05-2019, 05:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LessIsMore
Is factory boost really as high as 16 to 17PSI?
Strange. The more I’m reading, apparently it is. The new AMG GT R is apparently almost 20.

I’ve misunderstood the .csv output all this time, I guess (and sounds like most other people have too). I thought ECU psi is what the car thought it was trying to achieve while Boost was the actual real psi.

I know I’ve asked several times over many months for more detail into what the readouts mean, what ideal values are, what we should be looking for, etc. and it never gets answered.
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007JATT 007JATT is offline
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Default 10-05-2019, 06:28 PM

I just got done installing my JB4 and new BMS intake kit. Right away on engine startup got engine check light and upon scan two codes 222D and 227D any idea what they are? after deleting the codes it ran fine.

also had one misfire .. will post logs shortly.
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007JATT 007JATT is offline
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Default 10-05-2019, 06:34 PM

Here are the logs! Still a noob at this so please let me know if I'm doing anything wrong?
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2019-10-05 17_34_59_Map-1.csv (3.5 KB, 8 views)
File Type: csv 2019-10-05 17_36_21_Map-1.csv (34.4 KB, 6 views)
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Default 10-05-2019, 07:57 PM

Another misfire? What cylinders?
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Default 10-05-2019, 09:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by ezatnova
Strange. The more I’m reading, apparently it is. The new AMG GT R is apparently almost 20.

I’ve misunderstood the .csv output all this time, I guess (and sounds like most other people have too). I thought ECU psi is what the car thought it was trying to achieve while Boost was the actual real psi.
Yeah ... hmm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ezatnova
I know I’ve asked several times over many months for more detail into what the readouts mean, what ideal values are, what we should be looking for, etc. and it never gets answered.
I do recall you asking that previously.

I have 2 thoughts: Either the 16PSI is the highest stock boost the engine will see in only some conditions and will be less most of the time*, or ... we are just reading the JB4 logs wrong.
Both could potentially be true.

Terry, please - are you able to help us understand and read the log boost values in the context of factory boost being 16PSI?

Obviously I am making much more than factory power with my JB4 logs reading 16PSI (map 5), but it's hard to reconcile that with reliable sources stating the factory boost level is 16 psi. Is this why the JB4 is designed with a boost additive value as opposed to an absolute target PSI for different maps like the N54 JB4?

* Based on reading some other conjecture that the ECU mapping is designed to deliver consistent power, not peak power, at all times. Whereas if conditions are great for power (cool, low iat) then the ECU will actually request less than 16psi because it is able to meet the target power at lower boost. Conversely if conditions are not ideal for power (hot, hight ait, high DA) the engine may need to add a couple more PSI than normal ( up to 16 c63/ 17.4 c63s) to make the target then it will. IF that is true, it is a new wrinkle in OEM ECU functionality to me.


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Last edited by LessIsMore; 10-05-2019 at 09:53 PM..
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Default 10-10-2019, 09:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by 007JATT
Here are the logs! Still a noob at this so please let me know if I'm doing anything wrong?
Initial install codes indicate the ECU was not sleeping when you disconnected a sensor.

For logging press the gas pedal fully, but these two part throttle logs seem normal to me.


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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007JATT 007JATT is offline
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Default 10-10-2019, 11:46 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
Initial install codes indicate the ECU was not sleeping when you disconnected a sensor.

For logging press the gas pedal fully, but these two part throttle logs seem normal to me.
Thank you Terry, I created a new thread with additional logs on map 2 and few concerns

I will get additional logs the way you suggested.

Thanks
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Default 10-11-2019, 07:28 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hermanlo
Has anyone encountered no boost pressure increase after fitting in JB4? Logs show boost pressure at only 15psi to 16psi no matter what map I use...
Can you post a log to evaluate?


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Default Yesterday, 11:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by LessIsMore
Yeah ... hmm.



I do recall you asking that previously.

I have 2 thoughts: Either the 16PSI is the highest stock boost the engine will see in only some conditions and will be less most of the time*, or ... we are just reading the JB4 logs wrong.
Both could potentially be true.

Terry, please - are you able to help us understand and read the log boost values in the context of factory boost being 16PSI?

Obviously I am making much more than factory power with my JB4 logs reading 16PSI (map 5), but it's hard to reconcile that with reliable sources stating the factory boost level is 16 psi. Is this why the JB4 is designed with a boost additive value as opposed to an absolute target PSI for different maps like the N54 JB4?

* Based on reading some other conjecture that the ECU mapping is designed to deliver consistent power, not peak power, at all times. Whereas if conditions are great for power (cool, low iat) then the ECU will actually request less than 16psi because it is able to meet the target power at lower boost. Conversely if conditions are not ideal for power (hot, hight ait, high DA) the engine may need to add a couple more PSI than normal ( up to 16 c63/ 17.4 c63s) to make the target then it will. IF that is true, it is a new wrinkle in OEM ECU functionality to me.
Sorry missed this post. Not quite sure what your question is though.

Map0 is the factory boost levels with no JB4 intervention. It's in complete pass though mode. You can monitor those under various loads, temperatures, barometric pressures, engine speeds, gear, etc, and come up with a complex 3D chart of factory boost levels.

As we don't have the logging channel for factory flash target, and because it varies so much, we can not implement absolute boost maps yet with the platform like we have for other platforms but we will in the future. To program an absolute target map we need to know what the factory target is at that moment. Since it's too complex to predict on the platform the only way to get that data is by reading it from the ECU directly.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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