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Default PI Rail/Spacer vs. Manifold Discussion - 05-29-2018, 03:37 PM

So now that we have a few different intake options and a few different fuel rail options I thought it would be beneficial to have a discussion on the pros/cons of a manifold over a PI rail/spacer.

The way I see it is that by now everyone has switched over to/copied Fuel-It's design when it comes to PI spacers. Does anyone else think that design is sub-optimal? If you look at how a fuel injector sprays, in this spacer design it will just blast the opposing wall with fuel. I have no clue how Steve came to the conclusion that it would atomize and distribute fuel correctly but I have a hard time believing that 6 cylinders with questionable fueling outshines the old design with the weird cylinder 1 offset.

On the other hand, the manifolds have a much better angle when it comes to fuel spraying into the ports of the head but I question the use of aluminum as an intake manifold on something so sensitive to heat soak. Also I worry about the quality of the stuff coming out of China.

What are your guys thoughts? Has anyone actually tested any of this stuff or did everyone just start selling basically the same two products to follow the crowd?


09 335 - 6266
07 335i - 6870, E85 - SOLD
08 335xi - 6466, custom direct port meth - SOLD

Last edited by Milan; 05-29-2018 at 03:44 PM..
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Default 05-29-2018, 03:55 PM

The PI spacer was the first cheap solution that came to fruition. After that everyone saw it is an actual fuel solution to our issues and went on from there to be copied.

Personally I'm a fan of the integrated manifolds with PI, less room for leaks and mistakes. We have tested this intake manifold on a few of our development ST cars over 750whp. My cousin has been running one on his since Nov 2016 with over 30 psi put to it and a bunch of 1/2 mile runs ACF 6266 top mount.

http://www.burgertuning.com/N54_PORT..._MANIFOLD.html


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Default 05-29-2018, 04:12 PM

Re-design...

On the old port injection kits...cylinder one literally sprays the wall of the intake runner the minute it leaves the nozzle.

With our design which has even been copied by Evolution of Speed who has sold a manifold for a long time, the injector spray angle is perpendicular to the intake air stream, much like meth but instead of spraying the sidewall or the closest opposing wall, it has a diagonal spray pattern which we have shown provides much better distribution for the whole intake runner, not just part of the runner. In addition, with an intake manifold there are a couple draw backs.

-Weight, many of them are heavy.
-Distribution, take a look at where its spray...directly at the ridge between both intake valves and with the direction of air flow. That does not promote the best distribution.
-Heatsoak...the intake manifolds pull the heat from the cylinder head and heatsoak like crazy.

Ultimately we offer both solutions with a variety of options to meet your needs so do your homework and decide what works best for your application. If you decide to go with the manifold, yes, the Phoenix racing option is economical and functional, just not the most aesthetically pleasing if you're a stickler for clean welds etc. For most, it's a good inexpensive option.



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Default 05-29-2018, 05:47 PM

Steve, how did you test the distribution compared to your old design? From all of the spray videos I’ve seen, it shouldn’t be an issue splitting the ridge because a lot of these injectors spray in a V pattern.

Edit: The other think I'm curious about is injector size. What is the need for 72 lb or larger injectors? From what I recall we were making 800+ on 52's and now everyone is going bigger. Is there a reason for this or because we can? I feel like smaller is better for atomization


09 335 - 6266
07 335i - 6870, E85 - SOLD
08 335xi - 6466, custom direct port meth - SOLD

Last edited by Milan; 05-29-2018 at 06:21 PM..
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Default 06-01-2018, 02:37 PM

We've done numerous spray patter tests and removed kits multiple times to check valves and intake runners. In some cases we've also removed competitors products when upgrading systems. Here's a picture we published after removing a competitors product. This was a very good example of poor distribution due to injector angle and spray pattern.

Size of the injectors needed depends on the actual power being made and the fuel you are running. More ethanol requires more capacity and methanol requires even more capacity. For E85 lambda is approximately 9.6:1, meth is about 6:1

The lower the number, the more capacity that is required.

Name:  poor distibution.jpg
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