N54Tech.com - International Turbo Racing Discussion
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stuartinzg stuartinzg is offline
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Default Tuner wants to use WinOTL but I have requested MHD - thoughts? - 11-21-2017, 02:16 PM

Hi guys,

I'm having a delivery next week; all the parts for FBO off the bat.

I've asked a local tuning shop to install the parts and help me tune the car. He has a decent dyno and a lot of knowledge.

Obviously this is fairly run of the mill for him - it won't be a custom turbo RS6 pushing 1000 hp or a rally prepped car, so I assume he wants to load the data using WinOTL and get the car done as quickly (but as good) as possible.

He doesn't know about MHD, but he knows JB4 - his preference is not to touch anything piggyback.

I've asked for MHD as I want all the other functionality which comes with it (I've explained that it isn't a piggy back, but a full decrypt and load tool) I don't need to list that here, if you're reading this, you already know.

So my question is: can a custom tune be made from an MHD base map and if so, can it be done in WinOTL?

Can a WinOTL map be loaded into MHD? (i've seen that MHD supports TunerPro support but I've read a bit into WinOTL and apparently later versions are hashing some data when exported, making this an almost manual process of copying map data over if you want to have the map updates migrated across.

It's pretty difficult finding good tuners here (which undeniably he is), but it's a shame I'm struggling to get buy in to something which would help me in the longer run.

Maybe I'll get him to fit all the parts and then get MHD mapping done myself. I'm following a guy on YouTube (135i / cleanWHP) who swapped his MHD tune for a custom (from a local shop) and he's very happy with it, but he's lost the flexibility as far as I can tell.

What other benefits does the MHD tuning provide, which he can't achieve with WinOTL? I'm assuming there has been a lot of other work done (DCT for one) in tweaking and optimising what I won't be able to get from him within a 1-4 hour window. He seems to think that it's a case of increasing map values and letting the ECU adapt and figure out the rest. It does seem to be the case - but, I want more from the upgrade than just more boost.

Thoughts?


35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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DennisPacMo DennisPacMo is offline
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Default 11-21-2017, 02:59 PM

Is there any specific reason an MHD OTS tune wouldn't work? Full bolt on with a MHD Stage 2+ works just fine. I'd suggest downloading MHD and flashing the car first before installing all the stuff you just ordered. It will help familiarize you with the software and then you can change as your parts are installed.


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stuartinzg stuartinzg is offline
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Default 11-21-2017, 03:14 PM

Hi, yea I've had the software for a year and have been following the community,used it for logging, bought the maps and I have a decent cable. Technically it is what I want, to use OTS and check it on his dyno, buts he's adamant that OTS isn't the best solution, and as he knows how to set it up properly, why not do that? hence my question about winOTL and mixing both mhd base maps and his tweaks

Some background... I bought an apartment which used all my fun money. I also focused on non engine related upgrades. Wheels, tyres, suspension, ceramic protection, etc.

Now I'm ready and decided what's the point in doing one bit at a time, straight to stage2+, as I expect I'll need to replace other weak or worn out parts (o2 sensor, coils, clean intake)

I've had a couple of misfires under heavy torque, but to be fair, twice in two years. no starting issues.

The labour is cheaper if the car is all done when already apart. If I'm doing the diwnpipes, may as well do the fmic, charge pipe, inlets, intake, and all vac hoses-right?

Regarding tuning now, I wasn't sure about the oem cp, mine is already running 1M power from stock (340hp), and I've read a lot of stories, but probably for every failure 1000 are OK. I've left it bone stock, just using logging tools

What are your thoughts on my post about WinOTL and getting s custom map done but still using MHD and all its benefits? Has anyone done that?


35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories


Last edited by stuartinzg; 11-21-2017 at 03:23 PM..
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Terry @ BMS Terry @ BMS is offline
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Default 11-21-2017, 03:22 PM

Have them install the parts then we can help you on the tuning end remotely. All you need is a JB4 installed on the car, and then load the off the shelf back end flash map via BB or MHD software, record a JB4 log on map1, and we can take it from there.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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stuartinzg stuartinzg is offline
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Default 11-21-2017, 03:35 PM

Hi terry, appreciate the reply. We haven't spoken before, but thanks for all the work you guys have done on the platform, it's really made it accessible to people like me.

I'm just a soon to be fbo setup, looking for max 400whp,I'm not willing to invest in dodson or turbos for another couple of years, and meth or e60+ is like star dust here, so from a layman's perspective what will jb4 give me which I can't get with mhd alone?
My main concern is installation, as this guy won't want to do that (seems to have a thing for piggyback systems, probably hasn't seen a decent one) , I'll need to find someone else in this part of Europe.
I'll be the first to admit I love new toys, but struggling to justify


35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Terry @ BMS Terry @ BMS is offline
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Default 11-21-2017, 03:36 PM

For starters you can all but ditch your custom tuner, and endless logs and changes, as the JB4 does most of the tuning for you itself. But a break down of some of the benefits are in the FAQ here: http://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=29236


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 11-21-2017, 03:50 PM

Interesting, I've read all of it; certainly seems like a great product combined with a backend flash. I take it that MHD and Jb4 can be run together, i.e all features concurrent? Jb4 protection plus mhd functions, like cold start delete, burble control, kickdown delete, etc?


35iS, Black/Coral Red, 19" BBS CH-R/MPSS, Golf T, Stubby, LED 80w halo's, X6 tips, CarPro CQuartz, Custom painted accessories

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Default 11-21-2017, 04:03 PM

Answered my own question, I have to run a backend bms flash, but still get access to certain features. I'm still reading into how the two play together


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Terry @ BMS Terry @ BMS is offline
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Default 11-21-2017, 06:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by stuartinzg
Interesting, I've read all of it; certainly seems like a great product combined with a backend flash. I take it that MHD and Jb4 can be run together, i.e all features concurrent? Jb4 protection plus mhd functions, like cold start delete, burble control, kickdown delete, etc?
Exactly, best of both worlds. Changes to tables that can only be done via flash, plus the on the fly map changes, boost by gear, in dash gauges, and advanced safety and tuning functions the JB4 offers.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 11-22-2017, 03:13 PM

Yeah, ditch your local tuner - the very fact he's not open to using the JB4 or MHD means he's not the guy for you. You don't need a local tuner with JB4+MHD. And if you decided you DO want some tuning help, reach out to either BMS as Terry offered, or PM David Trebila (username: trebila) - he can do it easily and remotely.


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