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Tuppidsay Tuppidsay is offline
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Default 08-09-2018, 11:59 PM

Found the problem. RPM wire was in the wrong spot. Got a meth pid now and its definetaly working. Now the tuning begins.

Thanks all.
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File Type: csv 2018-08-09 22_57_02.csv (9.8 KB, 29 views)
File Type: csv 2018-08-09 22_53_02.csv (10.9 KB, 30 views)
File Type: csv 2018-08-09 22_50_50.csv (11.1 KB, 28 views)


2008 BMW 535i SPORT - FBO - VTT GC LITES - JB4 - Custom BEF - BMS METH - PROMETH PI
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(#127)
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N54-SHI N54-SHI is offline
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Default 08-12-2018, 09:48 AM

pump is work ok(I had a light for pump). pi is work ok,but no meth flow!
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(#128)
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Default 08-22-2018, 10:16 AM

Then something is blocking flow. Injectors are opening.
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(#129)
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cebrailbakan cebrailbakan is offline
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Default 08-22-2018, 01:07 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
Then something is blocking flow. Injectors are opening.
Terry , please admit that PMI is not a good system, you experienced this. Donít let people blow their engine. When people have problems, you do not pay the costs, no ? So , why you force the conditions when there is a more reliable systems. Please shelve this nonsense PMI wiring until you find a reliable solution.


Bmw E90 2007 AT 335xi MSD80,Jb4 G5 ISO,
Full Bolt Ons, Forged Internals, Meth PI, JB4 PI contoller, Zage Turbos, TFT inlet system,xHP Stage 3 trans Flash.

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(#130)
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Default 08-22-2018, 01:09 PM

I've always said I dislike PMI, and never suggest it. I prefer two nozzles in the chargepipe for meth. But I'm not the dictator here, people can run what they want, and we will help them as much as possible with whatever they want to run.


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(#131)
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cebrailbakan cebrailbakan is offline
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Default 08-22-2018, 01:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
I've always said I dislike PMI, and never suggest it. I prefer two nozzles in the chargepipe for meth. But I'm not the dictator here, people can run what they want, and we will help them as much as possible with whatever they want to run.
No one can accuse you of dictatorship, what I mean is that you support a system that carries a lot of risks. People trust you very much, if you say do not use this system in a certain way, no one will use so you wonít support it


Bmw E90 2007 AT 335xi MSD80,Jb4 G5 ISO,
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(#132)
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Default 08-22-2018, 01:53 PM

I want to improve the software to mitigate risks, so to do that I like to see logs posted here of how the cars are running so we can work on them. In terms of your specific issue I proposed a safety change that might have helped in the SS thread.


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(#133)
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mattgu40 mattgu40 is online now
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Default 08-23-2018, 01:35 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
I want to improve the software to mitigate risks, so to do that I like to see logs posted here of how the cars are running so we can work on them. In terms of your specific issue I proposed a safety change that might have helped in the SS thread.
That above scares me a little.

I want to make this system work as i have invested quite a bit of money and time in it.

To make things "Safer" in my further logging and DD.
I am tempted to add a T-piece, Check valve (aquamist), bms solenoid and cm5 nozzle in the charge pipe. triggered by a hubb swich.

leaving the pump wiring as it is.

bad idea ?

pretty sad to buy all the hardware and not having it to run properly.
nothing can't be fixed
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(#134)
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Default 08-23-2018, 08:06 AM

How is any of that going to make anything safer?


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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(#135)
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mattgu40 mattgu40 is online now
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Default 08-23-2018, 09:19 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
How is any of that going to make anything safer?
after thinking about it wont work as we cant confirm flow and reducing the pressure to the injectors by quite a bit.

not sure i want to put JB4 on map 7 as suggested before and go WOT on pump gas without being sure i get any flow. was just looking at a alternative to have at least l little bit of flow. as i cant really afford a spare engine.

what do you suggest
continue logging with lower boost map (2) and 94aki and send you logs ?
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(#136)
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Default 08-23-2018, 09:23 AM

Best option for WMI would be to add a turbine flow sensor I think and feed that in to the JB4 for it's mapping. Since there are so many common failure points with the systems that lead to no flow.


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Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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(#137)
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N54-SHI N54-SHI is offline
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Default 08-23-2018, 10:12 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cebrailbakan
Terry , please admit that PMI is not a good system, you experienced this. Donít let people blow their engine. When people have problems, you do not pay the costs, no ? So , why you force the conditions when there is a more reliable systems. Please shelve this nonsense PMI wiring until you find a reliable solution.
my engine had detonation after do these logs -,-... the cyl5 piston are broken. I bought a new engine just now. But this is the path I chose~ I don't blame BMS~
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(#138)
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mattgu40 mattgu40 is online now
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Default 08-24-2018, 02:58 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by N54-SHI
my engine had detonation after do these logs -,-... the cyl5 piston are broken. I bought a new engine just now. But this is the path I chose~ I don't blame BMS~
By looking at your previous posts i would not blame BMS.


Terry, What flow sensor do you recommend?
806-428? they dont seem to be available anymore

Any temporary solutions ?
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(#139)
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K.Jameel K.Jameel is offline
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Default 08-26-2018, 06:38 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
Best option for WMI would be to add a turbine flow sensor I think and feed that in to the JB4 for it's mapping. Since there are so many common failure points with the systems that lead to no flow.
please allow me to chime in, Aquamist has a Flow sensor assembly I think that could solve the issue according to the way it's works not hindering the flow.


BMW 335i '08 E92 N54, JB4 G5 IOS, BMS DCI, VRSF ***, BMS-Tial BOV Kit with Chargepipe, VRSF FMIC, BMS Meth Kit, JB4 MHD BEF, BMS PCV valve, BMS OCC. TCU Alpina_B3 Flash, .
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(#140)
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Tuppidsay Tuppidsay is offline
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Default 08-26-2018, 02:08 PM

Seems to me a pressure sensor on the rail would be the best solution. Flow sensor will still read with a leak at the rail, external or injector. Pressure sensor could detect a leak, no flow, stuck open injector, leaky injectors, etc. Both pressure and flow would be great but the jb4 only has so many ins and outs for this stuff. The other added benefit of a pressure sensor is there are already lots of ethanol compatible factory rail pressure sensors out there. just need to adapt one for our use.


2008 BMW 535i SPORT - FBO - VTT GC LITES - JB4 - Custom BEF - BMS METH - PROMETH PI
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(#141)
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Default 09-01-2018, 02:25 PM

as it is known , the JB4 Controller crashes with FSB , when you remove FSB , this time the pump does not work , so does the nozzle in the charge pipe , which causes the IAT’s high output. How do we get out of this ? Can we spray Methanol from charge pipe with CPI under the control of bms controller ? Is bms controller capable of triggering the meth pump ? As last thing , What should be meth safety and meth trigger settings in the PMI system?


Bmw E90 2007 AT 335xi MSD80,Jb4 G5 ISO,
Full Bolt Ons, Forged Internals, Meth PI, JB4 PI contoller, Zage Turbos, TFT inlet system,xHP Stage 3 trans Flash.

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(#142)
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Tuppidsay Tuppidsay is offline
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Default 09-01-2018, 11:42 PM

The bms controller has a trigger wire that you need to use to trigger a relay that supplies power to the pump. So yes the pi controller will trigger the pump. If u want to still run a cp nozzle just tee Into the meth line going to the fuel rail. Recommend something pretty small. Or you can grab fuel-it cpi injector and use it instead of a nozzle and splice it into the injector harness so all 7 fire at one. Last option is to have your tuner scale your tune so the iat reads cooler than actual iat temp. Rest assured your iats are actually cooler but the cooling is happening after the tmap. Or just buy a better intercooler


2008 BMW 535i SPORT - FBO - VTT GC LITES - JB4 - Custom BEF - BMS METH - PROMETH PI

Last edited by Tuppidsay; 09-02-2018 at 09:24 AM..
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(#143)
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mattgu40 mattgu40 is online now
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Default 09-01-2018, 11:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cebrailbakan
as it is known , the JB4 Controller crashes with FSB , when you remove FSB , this time the pump does not work , so does the nozzle in the charge pipe , which causes the IATís high output. How do we get out of this ? Can we spray Methanol from charge pipe with CPI under the control of bms controller ? Is bms controller capable of triggering the meth pump ? As last thing , What should be meth safety and meth trigger settings in the PMI system?
we are in the same boat sir, patiently waiting on them questions to be awnsered. really want to make this system work
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(#144)
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Default 09-02-2018, 09:51 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by K.Jameel
please allow me to chime in, Aquamist has a Flow sensor assembly I think that could solve the issue according to the way it's works not hindering the flow.
I've used their stand along flow sensor in the past... It was just OK. But probably the best of the ones out there. Wire it up with the flow signal going in to the JB4 15/16 and let's evaluate it.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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(#145)
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Default 09-02-2018, 09:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuppidsay
Seems to me a pressure sensor on the rail would be the best solution. Flow sensor will still read with a leak at the rail, external or injector. Pressure sensor could detect a leak, no flow, stuck open injector, leaky injectors, etc. Both pressure and flow would be great but the jb4 only has so many ins and outs for this stuff. The other added benefit of a pressure sensor is there are already lots of ethanol compatible factory rail pressure sensors out there. just need to adapt one for our use.
The FSB is a pressure sensor and while that works well in a normal setup, with PI meth there are many failure points. Lines could pressurize but injectors not open, for example, so not ideal here IMHO. On the plus side with pressure info we could setup the JB4 to scale meth flow on meth pressure. So when pressured dropped it could automatically scale IPW on the injectors up.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the Worlds fastest N20s, N54s, N55s, S55s, N63s, and S63s!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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(#146)
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FEDE/E92 FEDE/E92 is offline
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Default 09-09-2018, 09:48 PM

Terry.... should the wmi pump pressure be turned down if running PI using injectors? Since the pump set over 200psi and injectors are set for 50-60psi?
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FEDE/E92 FEDE/E92 is offline
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Default 09-11-2018, 04:20 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Terry @ BMS
The FSB is a pressure sensor and while that works well in a normal setup, with PI meth there are many failure points. Lines could pressurize but injectors not open, for example, so not ideal here IMHO. On the plus side with pressure info we could setup the JB4 to scale meth flow on meth pressure. So when pressured dropped it could automatically scale IPW on the injectors up.

Terry.... should the wmi pump pressure be turned down if running PI using injectors? Since the pump set over 200psi and injectors are set for 50-60psi?
Also would a AEM wmi guage would help making sure we have meth flow since JB4 Lets us know injectors are getting a signal
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Default 09-19-2018, 02:11 PM

Any improvements ?


Bmw E90 2007 AT 335xi MSD80,Jb4 G5 ISO,
Full Bolt Ons, Forged Internals, Meth PI, JB4 PI contoller, Zage Turbos, TFT inlet system,xHP Stage 3 trans Flash.

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FEDE/E92 FEDE/E92 is offline
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Default 09-19-2018, 06:08 PM

Well I'm going try AEM flow sensor since how that works
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mattgu40 mattgu40 is online now
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Default 09-20-2018, 01:03 PM

Awaiting instruction on how to get this working. I am on holiday for a few weeks and ready to be the Guinea pig if it does not involve running high boost without knowing if the pump is on or not
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