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Kay-os Kay-os is offline
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Default JB4+BEF+WMI, meth log guidance - 09-13-2018, 03:21 AM

Hello everyone. I have recently installed the BMS WMI kit and need some guidance on what to look for in a log to see if the meth is working properly or not. My car is 2014 M235i, FBO, JB4 + BEF + WMI (dual BM5 nozzles, 70% meth, boost additive 50, scaling 60, min flow boost 9.0) (see signature for details). Terry has helped me get this set up going. Here is an attached Map 3 log for reference.

I know you should log regularly to ensure the meth and JB4 is running as it should. However, I am new to WMI so I am not entirely sure what to look for in a meth log. I had JB4 for more than 2 yrs and have read the Logging Parameter thread (https://www.n54tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=21269) many times so I kind of know what a basic log should look like, however there isn't much info on what a meth log should look like.

SOooo...here are my questions:

1) What are the main things I should look for in Map 3 log which will show healthy meth flow and JB4 working normally? Graph of a good Map 3 meth log is appreciated.

2) Correct me if I am wrong, the solenoid will detect meth line pressure, and JB4 will convert this current into flow percentage. I understand if flow is low (eg due to empty tank), this will show up as decrease meth flow % in the gauge, and (hopefully) the JB4 will activate failsafe. Any examples of a graph showing a log with this happening?

3) What happens if there is a flow issue (leaking, or block nozzles) after the solenoid? I ask because if this happens, JB4 will still detect normal line pressure and will show normal meth flow %. Terry has mentioned the fuel trims will go up if this happens. Apart from fuel trims going up, is there anything else I should look for? Any examples of a graph showing flow issues after the solenoid?

4) What are the essential parameters to monitor DAILY on the JB4 app to ensure the WMI is working normally (apart from the obvious such as boost, meth flow, and IAT)? Is Avg Ign useful for general monitoring of the system?

Hopefully this information will help others as well. Thanks!
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2018-09-10 70%map3a.csv (11.7 KB, 291 views)


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 09-14-2018, 10:44 AM

1- Timing, AFR, Trims, HPFP, Meth signal.

2- I don't have any examples off hand, but I have seen it happen when meth signal goes lower, boost will drop as well.

3-When trims are maxed, and meth signal is there indicates an issue and will trigger safety.

4- You named them all

Log looks good, timing is really low at first then comes right back up. Might have had some air in the line for a second.
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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 09-14-2018, 05:03 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Payam @ BMS
1- Timing, AFR, Trims, HPFP, Meth signal.

2- I don't have any examples off hand, but I have seen it happen when meth signal goes lower, boost will drop as well.

3-When trims are maxed, and meth signal is there indicates an issue and will trigger safety.

4- You named them all

Log looks good, timing is really low at first then comes right back up. Might have had some air in the line for a second.
Thanks for the reply. I have done a few logs and the timing are all low at first. Perhaps it's not air in the line? How to resolve this? Can lowering the min flow boost help?


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 09-19-2018, 07:19 AM

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2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 09-19-2018, 09:03 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kay-os
Thanks for the reply. I have done a few logs and the timing are all low at first. Perhaps it's not air in the line? How to resolve this? Can lowering the min flow boost help?
You can try that, but I don't think that would help.


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 09-21-2018, 04:15 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Payam @ BMS
You can try that, but I don't think that would help.
Attached is a most recent log Map 3. I have lowered the min flow boost to 7.0, upped the boost safety to 20psi. The rest is as before (70% meth, boost additive 50, scaling 60). It looks like timing is a bit better at the beginning? Anything I can do to try to improve it? Like lower the min flow boost to 6.0? Shall I try to increase the boost additive?

Thanks!
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2018-09-20 70%7psiA.csv (12.5 KB, 218 views)


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 09-21-2018, 10:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kay-os
Attached is a most recent log Map 3. I have lowered the min flow boost to 7.0, upped the boost safety to 20psi. The rest is as before (70% meth, boost additive 50, scaling 60). It looks like timing is a bit better at the beginning? Anything I can do to try to improve it? Like lower the min flow boost to 6.0? Shall I try to increase the boost additive?

Thanks!
If you want better timing you need better fuel in the fuel tank. I would just leave it as is unless future logs show that timing is better down low. You will make more power with good timing at the same boost level so don't think you only need more boost to make more power.


2011 E92 335i Auto | 0-60=3.6 | 11.7@125MPH SOLD
2014 E84 X1 35i | 0-60=4.55 | 12.75@107MPH | VRSF CP | BMS Intake | Custom MHD Tune | VRSF 7" Intercooler | ER Turbo Outlet | XHP Stage 3 | Pure Stage 2 V3 | Pure Inlet | DV+ | AR DP | AEM Methanol Injection
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Default 09-21-2018, 11:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Boost
If you want better timing you need better fuel in the fuel tank. I would just leave it as is unless future logs show that timing is better down low. You will make more power with good timing at the same boost level so don't think you only need more boost to make more power.
This is accurate. People get hung up on boost numbers. I have had my butt Dyno tell me the car was faster on less boost with better timing.

But if you can get more boost, and more timing, why not both.

100% meth, higher quantity of meth (cm5+cm7), lower iat, better qaulity fuel, ethanol, torco/octane booster, race fuel (100 octane).

The last 3 will make the largest difference. And by octane booster, I do not mean the stuff you find at the gas station. If you are really interested you can Google torco. If money is no object you can buy that stuff by the case if you really want to. I mostly hear about people using it for a drag night or for tuning purposes.


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Default 09-22-2018, 06:09 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Boost
If you want better timing you need better fuel in the fuel tank. I would just leave it as is unless future logs show that timing is better down low. You will make more power with good timing at the same boost level so don't think you only need more boost to make more power.
Thanks for your input. Unfortunately, I have tried a bunch of gas stations and all the fuels are pretty much the same ****ty quality. I will try 80% meth after the current tank of 70% is finished, hopefully it will improve timing.


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 10-10-2018, 11:12 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Payam @ BMS
You can try that, but I don't think that would help.
To improve on the low timing at low rpm, I have upped the meth to 80%. Here are 4 logs (meth starts spraying at 7psi, 6.5psi, and the 2 logs at 3 psi). Boost additive at 50 and scaling at 60. At 7 psi, timing is zero at low rpm. At 6.5 psi, timing looks better. At 3 psi, I think timing is better down low, but boost is a bit wobbly? My logic is to improve timing down low, spraying meth earlier should help.

1) Please comment on the logs. At which psi should I start spraying? Is it safe even if timing goes to zero at low rpm?

2) If timing is persistently low at low rpm, should I use the PUMP BEF instead of the current RACE BEF (EWG RACE 10 map) I am using now? The pump gas I am using is 98 ron (93 oct) and I don't think I can get better pump gas than this.

3) Occasionally, I have been getting this code frequently: 101F02 throttle angle- intake manifold pressure, correlation: limit exceeded. Any issue?

Thanks!
Attached Files
File Type: csv 2018-10-10 80%7psiA.csv (11.1 KB, 208 views)
File Type: csv 2018-10-09 80%6.5psiB.csv (8.2 KB, 200 views)
File Type: csv 2018-10-11 80%3psiC.csv (11.5 KB, 194 views)
File Type: csv 2018-10-11 80%3psiD.csv (11.6 KB, 195 views)


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 10-10-2018, 11:21 PM

Don't set your meth trigger psi that low. You will be spraying meth when you aren't intending to. Not sure why you would be using a race BEF on pump gas. I mean it is called Pump BEF for a reason. The issue is still not enough octane in your fuel tank to keep timing above 0 (some of the logs). I would set meth trigger psi to 7 and leave it as is.


2011 E92 335i Auto | 0-60=3.6 | 11.7@125MPH SOLD
2014 E84 X1 35i | 0-60=4.55 | 12.75@107MPH | VRSF CP | BMS Intake | Custom MHD Tune | VRSF 7" Intercooler | ER Turbo Outlet | XHP Stage 3 | Pure Stage 2 V3 | Pure Inlet | DV+ | AR DP | AEM Methanol Injection
2019 Audi TT RS | 0-60=3.17 | 11.06@125 mph 92 oct | DS1 Stage 1 Tune
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Default 10-11-2018, 06:56 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmer_Boost
Don't set your meth trigger psi that low. You will be spraying meth when you aren't intending to. Not sure why you would be using a race BEF on pump gas. I mean it is called Pump BEF for a reason. The issue is still not enough octane in your fuel tank to keep timing above 0 (some of the logs). I would set meth trigger psi to 7 and leave it as is.
Hi Bimmer-Boost. Thanks for the comments. I am using Race BEF because someone else asked which map to use on 93 oct and Terry said start with Race BEF map (https://www.n54tech.com/forums/showt...=51166&page=22). I have also posted a log on the support with the Race BEF map and Payam said it was good (https://www.n54tech.com/forums/showt...t=50956&page=2). However, I am thinking maybe I should switch to the pump BEF map.

Payam, what do you think?


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 10-17-2018, 05:56 AM

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2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 10-17-2018, 09:37 AM

Timing being low at a lower RPM is normal. The logs look very good to me. I would leave methanol starting at 7 psi.
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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 10-18-2018, 07:43 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Payam @ BMS
Timing being low at a lower RPM is normal. The logs look very good to me. I would leave methanol starting at 7 psi.
Thanks Payam for the reply. I should add that when meth spays at 6.5 or 7psi, trims at low rpm is inconsistent. Id say about 50% of logs are similar to the trims you have shown above, and 50% of the time the trims at low rpm is almost or at zero. Still good to stay on the RACE BEF?

And what about this code? Occasionally, I have been getting this code frequently: 101F02 throttle angle- intake manifold pressure, correlation: limit exceeded. Any issue?

Thanks!


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 10-25-2018, 10:44 PM

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2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 05-03-2020, 06:54 AM

Hello. Recently downloaded firmware EWG 18. Wanted to see if things are good. Could you please have a look at my log and see if things are ok?
Thanks!
See signature for all info and WMI settings.
Attached Files
File Type: csv 20200502_090443_runs(1).csv (6.9 KB, 151 views)


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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Default 05-03-2020, 09:31 AM

Overall log looks clean, a little noise on cyl 4/5 but not horrible


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It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Default 05-03-2020, 05:50 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave @ BMS/Fuel-It!
Overall log looks clean, a little noise on cyl 4/5 but not horrible
Great! Thanks for ur help!


2014 BMW M235i auto. JB4 & EWG connector + BEF (BMS EWG Race 10 map), 98 RON pump fuel (93 oct), BMS WMI kit (dual BM5 nozzles, 80% meth mix, boost additive 50, Scaling 60, min flow boost 6.5), GruppeM intake, ER CP, Forge BOV, Wagner Evo II competition intercooler, ER ******* **, eisenmann exhaust, quaife LSD.
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