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Default JB4 Logging Parameters - 10-23-2019, 04:26 PM

Hey guys,

We’ll use this thread for details and discussions on Kia specific JB4 logging parameters.

Boost: Pressure in front of the throttle body in PSI. Normal range from the factory is 12-14psi depending on barometric pressure, intake temperatures, engine speed, time under boost, and other factors. Boost will increase under JB4 maps and expect to see a normal range of 16-20psi depending on the map selected. Note when reading boost short term “spikes”, especially against a closed throttle body, are not relevant. Look for sustained boost during longer pulls for a more accurate reading of what your boost pressure is. If boost exceeds the boost safety setting on the user adjustment page the JB4 will disable. Remember with this platform boost targeting is LOAD based which means at lower elevation, colder temperatures, you'll have a LOWER boost target than higher elevation, warmer temperatures. The factory logic attempts to adjust it's boost target to keep engine performance similar across a wide range of operating conditions.

Boost2: Pressure behind the throttle body in the intake manifold. This is generally a “better” indication of how much boost the engine is actually under. Normally Boost2 will mirror Boost unless the throttle blade is closing enough to limit manifold boost.

Target: This is how much boost over factory the JB4 is requesting. It will vary by JB4 map, running conditions, engine speed, throttle position, and a host of other internal tuning factors. Generally map2 runs around 6psi over factory peak tapering down to 4psi over factory at higher engine speed.

ECU_PSI: This is how much boost the ECU is observing and will generally mirror factory boost levels. At high enough boost levels Boost – Target = ECU_PSI.

DME_BT: This would represent how much boost the ECU is requesting at an given moment but is not enabled on the Kia platform yet. Instead we use an internal algorithm to estimate what the factory boost target should be.

Pedal: How far down the gas pedal is being pushed 0-100%

Thrtl: The position of the throttle body 0-100%. This value is run by the ECU and it’s important to realize that the throttle body itself is substantially over sized, meaning that there needs to be significant throttle movement before you’ll see any deviation between Boost and Boost2. The ECU generally uses throttle to regulate ECU_PSI to DME_BT, closing throttle when ECU_PSI exceeds DME_BT, which can happen for a variety of reasons. Most commonly a dynamic target change due to traction control or some other on ECU driven on demand target change. On cars with fully modified exhaust systems you might see boost creep over target in higher gears and when that happens you’ll see throttle close proportionally to maintain Boost2 on target.

WGDC: The position of the wastegate actuator 0-100%. This parameter is not yet enabled for Kia.

Ign1-6: Timing advance in the specific cylinder. Generally all cylinders will agree but as you start to approach a limit of Boost for a given fuel quality/octane level then you’ll start to see 3.5 degree timing drops in specific cylinders. The lower the grade fuel the more frequently you’ll see drops. If you see drops in the same cylinder repeating several times in a single gear then it’s usually an indicator that you’d be better off with a lower Target for the given fuel. Note that timing in all cylinders regularly drops negative during shifts and under some other driving conditions so do not confused mapped changes affecting all cylinders with cylinder specific timing drops when evaluating logs. Also note cyl1 is sampled via OBDII while cyl2-6 are sampled via RAM read so there will be some timing differences between the readings due to the different protocols. Cyl 2-6 are not available for all vehicle models. Note starting with v17 firmware FUA = 1 can be set so that cyl2-6 reflect learned knock adaption instead. It provides the same information but in a different format. Higher values mean more timing is being removed.

Ign Avg: This is not enabled for the Kia platform yet.

AFR: Air/fuel ratio bank1. Factory air/fuel ratio runs stoich 14.7:1 during lean spool mode and quickly drops down to 10:1 under sustained full throttle. The JB4 using FuelEn will lean out the AFR dynamically to a target of around 11.9:1. If AFR goes leaner than 14:1 at higher RPM the JB4 will disable.

AFR2: Same as above but for bank2. Note 4 cylinder vehicles will have only one bank and AFR2/Trim2 will always show as 0.

Trim: Fuel trims in bank1. The JB4 has scaled fuel trims for quicker viewing, 25 in JB4 logs = 0%, 50 = +34%, and 0 = -34%. Generally fuel trims will jump up in to the 40s under peak torque and drop down towards 25 at higher RPM.

Trim2: Fuel trims in bank2. These will mirror Trim generally and if there is a deviation may indicate a fuel wire is loose or installed improperly. The JB4 will disable if Trim and Trim2 have more than a 15pt variation.

FuelEn: This represents the bank1 dynamic o2 sensor offset required to maintain a 11.9:1 AFR at full throttle. It’s managed by the JB4 internally using its dynamic double fuel control PID.

CalcTQ: This represents the bank2 equivalent of FuelEn.

Gear: Currently selected gear.

MPH: The road speed in miles per hour.

FP_H: The fuel pressure in mbar of the high pressure pump. Generally will sit above 10. If FP_H dips this indicates you’re using more fuel than the high pressure system can maintain, generally comes up on those running heavy E85 mixtures at higher boost levels. If FP_H drops below 7 the JB4 will disable.

FP_L: Not currently enabled for Kia via CANbus, some customers have this linked up to Fuel-IT low pressure analog sensors they’ve added on. If you have not added on a separate low fuel pressure sensor ignore this parameter.

E85: The ethanol mixture. Generally only accurate if also equipped with a Fuel-IT flex fuel sensor. There is a BETA version of a virtual flex fuel logic in the latest firmware but it’s not fully accurate and only there for data collection.

Meth: If equipped with a WMI kit this represents your meth flow 0-100%.

WaterF: Engine water temperature

OilF: Not yet supported on the Stinger

TransTemp: Transmission oil temperature

FF: The feed forward component of the optional EWG PID control system. Adjusted via the FF and duty bias user adjustment settings, the PID output is added in to arrive at final WGDC.

WGDC: Stands for waste gate duty cycle, but it's technically the JB4 WGDC offset as wastegate control is shared between the JB4 and the ECU with EWG connectors equipped. Values above 50 are closing the WG more, values below 50 opening WG more, and exactly 50 is a complete pass through with no changes.

Clock: This is used for internal communication diagnostics and generally represents how many samples per second of CANbus data are being returned from the ECU. Not relevant to most users unless diagnosing a CANbus communications issue.


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psykostevo psykostevo is offline
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Default 10-23-2019, 08:02 PM

Thanks for the breakdown
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Default 10-24-2019, 07:17 AM

Excellent info Terry.
Hopefully we can get some of this parameters enabled soon.

Thanks for posting.

Last edited by robz; 10-25-2019 at 10:43 AM..
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whytiptoe whytiptoe is offline
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Default 10-24-2019, 03:44 PM

This is great Terry, I’ll be looking forward to sharing any info with you and the team utilizing the fuel-it plug in.
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RUFFSTUFF RUFFSTUFF is offline
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Default 10-25-2019, 08:27 AM

Big thumbs up!
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Hyperjetta Hyperjetta is offline
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Default 10-25-2019, 09:02 AM

Thanks!
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matt77 matt77 is offline
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Default 10-25-2019, 06:00 PM

We really need proper boost by gear or as I've mentioned before calculate it by RPM and speed. The current setup is really only good for WOT runs from a stop. When you use it on the street you come out of a corner in 2nd and floor it and you can feel the limited boost because it thinks you are in first. I've disabled it as it's a pain in these circumstances.
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Drewu272 Drewu272 is offline
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Default 11-13-2019, 10:44 AM

Is there a way to calculate the HP an Torque using these logs? Or this that only doable using a dyno?
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Terry @ BMS's Avatar
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Default 11-13-2019, 04:42 PM

There are log based dyno simulators but it's not going to be very accurate. Dragy is the best way to manage real world performance.


Burger Motorsports
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whytiptoe whytiptoe is offline
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Default 11-15-2019, 09:47 AM

Terry are there plans to start reporting the WGDC? would like to see if the waste gate is opening any to bleed off any boost. Just curious and it would be nice to see.
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Terry @ BMS's Avatar
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Default 11-15-2019, 09:53 AM

We plan to add it at some point yes, once we figure out how to pull it off CANbus.


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Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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whytiptoe whytiptoe is offline
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Default 01-23-2020, 11:15 AM

Terry, should the gear parameter not be updated?
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Steven TMAN Steven TMAN is offline
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Default 05-27-2020, 07:29 AM

I'm having an issue in Map2 in Comfort mode. If I need to pass a car that tries to speed up to prevent, Fuel enrichment is engaging around 88-90 and it's like I hit fuel cut. I can swap to Sport mode and it immediately pulls again. Any insight?
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Terry @ BMS's Avatar
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Default 05-27-2020, 07:38 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven TMAN
I'm having an issue in Map2 in Comfort mode. If I need to pass a car that tries to speed up to prevent, Fuel enrichment is engaging around 88-90 and it's like I hit fuel cut. I can swap to Sport mode and it immediately pulls again. Any insight?
Post a log of the problem in the support thread and we can check it out!


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Rem234 Rem234 is offline
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Default 06-18-2020, 09:13 AM

I have a 2020 Veloster N and when I activate the oil temp gauge it is not reading? Is this feature disabled for my vehicle?
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Team Tonka Team Tonka is offline
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Default 06-30-2020, 10:22 AM

BMS - per the below, at what times should the log show it above 10? I'm assuming I don't want it below 10 when going WOT or 100% peddle during acceleration? At slower crusing/driving speeds I think it will almost always be under 10 correct?

"FP_H: The fuel pressure in mbar of the high pressure pump. Generally will sit above 10. If FP_H dips this indicates you’re using more fuel than the high pressure system can maintain, generally comes up on those running heavy E85 mixtures at higher boost levels. If FP_H drops below 7 the JB4 will disable."
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Default 06-30-2020, 02:03 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rem234
I have a 2020 Veloster N and when I activate the oil temp gauge it is not reading? Is this feature disabled for my vehicle?
Yes we've got water temp only active right now! Working on oil temp.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Terry @ BMS's Avatar
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Default 06-30-2020, 02:04 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Team Tonka
BMS - per the below, at what times should the log show it above 10? I'm assuming I don't want it below 10 when going WOT or 100% peddle during acceleration? At slower crusing/driving speeds I think it will almost always be under 10 correct?

"FP_H: The fuel pressure in mbar of the high pressure pump. Generally will sit above 10. If FP_H dips this indicates you’re using more fuel than the high pressure system can maintain, generally comes up on those running heavy E85 mixtures at higher boost levels. If FP_H drops below 7 the JB4 will disable."
We're talking full load/throttle on high pressure. You'll know it's a problem because you'll see it rolling down as fuel demand increases.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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Corleone1 Corleone1 is offline
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Default 08-28-2020, 11:38 PM

Hello

Any updates in post 1?
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neonland neonland is offline
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Default 09-22-2020, 05:55 PM

With learned knock adaption turned on I'm guessing we want to always see a value of zero?
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Default 09-22-2020, 06:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by neonland
With learned knock adaption turned on I'm guessing we want to always see a value of zero?
That's unrealistic but lower is better than higher. What you see depends on the fuel. Usually if tuning for no corrections at all you're leaving power on the table.


Burger Motorsports
Home of the JB4 the worlds most popular turbocharged tuning system!

It is the sole responsibility of the purchaser and installer of any BMS part to employ the correct installation techniques required to ensure the proper operation of BMS parts, and BMS disclaims any and all liability for any part failure due to improper installation or use. It is the sole responsibility of the customer to verify that the use of their vehicle and items purchased comply with federal, state and local regulations. BMS claims no legal federal, state or local certification concerning pollution controlled motor vehicles or mandated emissions requirements. BMS products labeled for use only in competition racing vehicles may only be used on competition racing vehicles operated exclusively on a closed course in conjunction with a sanctioned racing event, in accordance with all federal and state laws, and may never be operated on public roads/highways. Please click here for more information on legal requirements related to use of BMS parts.
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