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Haynpunch Haynpunch is offline
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Default Alternator/Battery Bad? - 05-08-2019, 01:11 AM

Driving home the other day got the dreaded Christmas tree light display on the dash (battery, abs, etc...) car still ran ok and was able to make it home. As I pulled into the garage the car kinda struggled to make in. Ran codes and shut the car off.

2E98 Generator, Communication
2DC3 Control Clamp 15
2DEB Power Management, vehicle wiring system control
2DEC Power Management, Battery control

Checked voltage (Voltmeter) 11.4v, Put car on a slow 2amp charger for a couple days, Checked voltage 12.7-13.1

Cleared Codes, started car, no codes but battery light on dash remains on. With car running (idle) voltage is steady at 13.9-14.1

Torn between just replacing alternator or battery or both. Not sure how old battery is but I have owned the car for about 2.5yrs now, checked the battery and it is a 49agm world source one battery with no signs of date of purchase (date tabs were not removed) checked the world source once website and they only offer a 2yr warranty on the battery which leads me to believe the battery may be bad

Bad Alternator, Battery or Both....

Any suggestions?


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THE BEAST THE BEAST is offline
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Default 05-09-2019, 07:30 AM

Possible IBS ?
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codesx codesx is offline
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Default 05-09-2019, 09:30 AM

Battery issues so commonly cause the Christmas tree experience.

Don't replace the Battery and the Alternator without testing for which is bad.
Self testing isn't hard, and most garages will do it for free.

Given the battery light remains on during full charge, you should quickly get the CEL as well, indicating a charging fault, which can be due to Alternator, or Battery resistance.

Don't buy both. If you do, please ship me your Alternator


--

2008 335i Convertible, E93, N54, A/T (200,000+ km)
Wheels: 322 | Tires: R.275/35r18, F.245/40r18
TUNE: JB4/Trebila | 24 PSI | 100% Meth via dual BM5 | 94 Octane
BMS: JB4, Map 6 | WMI | 5" FMIC | OCC | DCI | Cowel Filters
TMAP: 3.5 barr
xHP Stage 3 (v2.0)
VRSF CP | HKS BOV
RB PCV Valve
NGK 5992 Plugs @ .020

Maintenance:
2018 - A/T Replaced | Plugs | Ign Coils | Walnut Blasting
2019 - Index 12 Injectors | VCG | OFHG & O-rings | Alternator w/ Clutch Pulley | Water Pump & TStat
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Default 05-09-2019, 03:49 PM

Definitely something weird going on.

Since charging the battery the other day, took it off the charger since then, battery held a voltage of 12.7 with no drop.

Today i get in the car start it up, no lights no codes, took it for a quick 15 min drive with the voltage menu up in display and 13-13.9v variation (never drops below 13v) as driving no issues. Pull into the garage let it idle for a couple mins and the voltage drops to 12.0 while idling even while reving the engine to 2k rpm voltage won't increase.

Not sure if its a bad connection somewhere or bad battery, soon as i get a chance ill go get the battery load tested and check all connections at the battery and the alternator


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nissubaru nissubaru is offline
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Default 05-10-2019, 12:23 PM

I chased around a bad alternator/IBS cable a while back but it turned out to be as simple as my ground strap cable being corroded. Misdiagnosed the hell out of it because I used a "bad" ground point with my multi-meter. It gave me low readings making me think the alternator was the issue, little did I realize at the time but if I used a different ground point I would have gotten perfect readings from my alternator.

Because the battery is in the back it's subject to the weak ground whereas another bolt (say on the engine block itself) has a fantastic ground. $10 on Amazon later and I have a thicc waterproof ground strap cable that should last a lifetime.

Checking the ground was a suggestion literally nobody on any of the forums recommended so even if I'm wrong I'm throwing this **** out there cause it takes 10 seconds to check.
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Default 05-10-2019, 05:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by nissubaru
I chased around a bad alternator/IBS cable a while back but it turned out to be as simple as my ground strap cable being corroded. Misdiagnosed the hell out of it because I used a "bad" ground point with my multi-meter. It gave me low readings making me think the alternator was the issue, little did I realize at the time but if I used a different ground point I would have gotten perfect readings from my alternator.

Because the battery is in the back it's subject to the weak ground whereas another bolt (say on the engine block itself) has a fantastic ground. $10 on Amazon later and I have a thicc waterproof ground strap cable that should last a lifetime.

Checking the ground was a suggestion literally nobody on any of the forums recommended so even if I'm wrong I'm throwing this **** out there cause it takes 10 seconds to check.
Thanks for the Tip ill definitely check my ground strap.


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codesx codesx is offline
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Default 05-16-2019, 09:34 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
Thanks for the Tip ill definitely check my ground strap.

Curious, did you get this issue resolved? If so, what was the solution?


--

2008 335i Convertible, E93, N54, A/T (200,000+ km)
Wheels: 322 | Tires: R.275/35r18, F.245/40r18
TUNE: JB4/Trebila | 24 PSI | 100% Meth via dual BM5 | 94 Octane
BMS: JB4, Map 6 | WMI | 5" FMIC | OCC | DCI | Cowel Filters
TMAP: 3.5 barr
xHP Stage 3 (v2.0)
VRSF CP | HKS BOV
RB PCV Valve
NGK 5992 Plugs @ .020

Maintenance:
2018 - A/T Replaced | Plugs | Ign Coils | Walnut Blasting
2019 - Index 12 Injectors | VCG | OFHG & O-rings | Alternator w/ Clutch Pulley | Water Pump & TStat
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Default UPDATE - 05-20-2019, 12:45 PM

So i went the least expensive route for now...

Checked ground strap, looks new still..
Changed the Voltage Regulator, easy 15-20min job vs replacing alternator, Contacts on Old vs New is significant, Part number on old vs new according to FCPeuro will not fit my car but in the description new part number replaces old so wasn't to worried about that.
Old VR Part#: F00M346033
New VR Part#: F00M346088
Ordered a new battery but...i took the old battery in for a load test first, ended up being good just needed "recharge" , Returned the new battery for now.

Put old battery on a slow 2amp charge for a day 13.2v, reinstalled, triple checked all wiring in battery compartment.

Started up, checked codes now I'm getting "2e97 Generator" code
at idle 14.1-14.6v, while driving 13.3-14.2 (using display hack)

Cleared code and it comes back (2e97 Generator) after restart

For now ill keep driving it and see if anything else comes up, hopefully i don't get stuck
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FBO
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nissubaru nissubaru is offline
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Default 05-20-2019, 01:24 PM

I feel for you brother, I eventually ended up with a second battery as well. Didn't need it in the long run but look at it this way, you have a backup battery now. I'd keep a set of jumper cables and that second battery charged up in your trunk in case you ever need it.

With that said, what's your issue again? Sounds like you just got a bunch of codes but how does the car drive otherwise?
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Default 05-20-2019, 03:40 PM

[There are issues with positive cable corroding at fuse box , behind glovd box. Mine was going bad and gave me erratic voltage readings untill it left me stranded with no power. I connected DVM to batt and jiggled wiring behind fuse panel . Had a signaficant voltage drop and gain when moving wiring.

Ended up making it home , went to dealer next day. Back of fuse box was melted. They replaced the complete B+ cable from batt to starter and a new fuse box.
All covered by recall including loaner car.
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Default 05-20-2019, 04:52 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by nissubaru
I feel for you brother, I eventually ended up with a second battery as well. Didn't need it in the long run but look at it this way, you have a backup battery now. I'd keep a set of jumper cables and that second battery charged up in your trunk in case you ever need it.

With that said, what's your issue again? Sounds like you just got a bunch of codes but how does the car drive otherwise?
Car runs and drives fine no issues / voltage isnít erratic pretty steady


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Hybrids
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Roadarmor Roadarmor is offline
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Default 05-31-2019, 09:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
Car runs and drives fine no issues / voltage isnít erratic pretty steady
Just curious would you check the positive terminal if its get hot (I mean up normal hot )??!!

I`m still have the same issues. my car throws codes some times.
2DEC/2ACC/2DEB.
my issue started when I was traveled and the car was parked for 2 months.
and when I start using it as daily ride. some times I get battery indicator at the cluster, I assumed that battery is getting old and start to faded and effected by long sleep for couple month, while that I start smell weired odd scents and noticed my rear windshield get fogged. (and yes the damn battery starts leaking acids and boiling )
thanks god I noticed early and deal with it and take it out before huge loss to my ride.
I swapped the oem battery with a small lightweight ones. ( used for racing )
but then I faced new issues like no starts engine or blink lights, time & date resets and most terrified ( super hot positive battery lead).
So now I bought new oem battery (IBS plug connected) and new alternator.
but still have the same code above.


my car : E92 335i 2007 6MT FBO upgraded turbos PI
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Default 06-01-2019, 05:22 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadarmor
Just curious would you check the positive terminal if its get hot (I mean up normal hot )??!!

I`m still have the same issues. my car throws codes some times.
2DEC/2ACC/2DEB.
my issue started when I was traveled and the car was parked for 2 months.
and when I start using it as daily ride. some times I get battery indicator at the cluster, I assumed that battery is getting old and start to faded and effected by long sleep for couple month, while that I start smell weired odd scents and noticed my rear windshield get fogged. (and yes the damn battery starts leaking acids and boiling )
thanks god I noticed early and deal with it and take it out before huge loss to my ride.
I swapped the oem battery with a small lightweight ones. ( used for racing )
but then I faced new issues like no starts engine or blink lights, time & date resets and most terrified ( super hot positive battery lead).
So now I bought new oem battery (IBS plug connected) and new alternator.
but still have the same code above.


my car : E92 335i 2007 6MT FBO upgraded turbos PI
No weird stuff going on here... all seem well so far been only 500 miles since changing out the VR.

Did you register the new battery when you swapped out? if the AH is different you need to update all that.


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Roadarmor Roadarmor is offline
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Default 06-02-2019, 07:03 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
No weird stuff going on here... all seem well so far been only 500 miles since changing out the VR.

Did you register the new battery when you swapped out? if the AH is different you need to update all that.
not for the lightweight battery.
but registered for last oem one placed.
I`m considering to give a shoot for Voltage regulater such a easy & quick swap.
what`s the codes still pop`n up ?
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Default 06-02-2019, 09:26 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roadarmor
not for the lightweight battery.
but registered for last oem one placed.
I`m considering to give a shoot for Voltage regulater such a easy & quick swap.
what`s the codes still pop`n up ?
I'm no expert but I don't think you can just run any type of battery without registering it. But I don't know

Yes VR replacement is very easy, I used a bit wrench to get to the torx screws.

No CEL but when I check codes I still get the 2e97 Generator code but no issue other than that. Car runs and drives normal
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dpaul dpaul is offline
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Default 06-02-2019, 03:56 PM

FWIW, registration is not important. The notion that is required seems to be often repeated, but there are some detailed posts on e90 forum explaining why it is not important.

On the other hand, if you change the type (flooded lead acid to AGM for example) or if you change the AH rating of the battery, coding is absolutely required. This is what allows the charging system to be properly adaptive.

Coding can be done with Carly, ISTA/D or old skool with NCSExper, in the latter case by either changing the VO or just editing Klasse_Batterie parameter in CAS.
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Roadarmor Roadarmor is offline
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Default 06-02-2019, 05:33 PM

Yeah your right,
Registration is just to tell the Charging system what type of battery and the capacity is dealing with to calculates between discharges and charging.
Damn I was hope it's something obviously known to fix and deal with even if it's costly.
Much better than some things cost less than your coffee and cause nightmare don't know how it even starts.
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codesx codesx is offline
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Default 06-03-2019, 09:32 AM

New vs Old batteries of the same type optimally receiving different charging rates.
Further, old batteries will not register as high a voltage, which is OK.
You don't want your system forcefully pushing an old battery, trying to reach the same voltage as a new one.
Personally, I'd follow the book on this. Our batteries tend to have poor enough life span as it is.


--

2008 335i Convertible, E93, N54, A/T (200,000+ km)
Wheels: 322 | Tires: R.275/35r18, F.245/40r18
TUNE: JB4/Trebila | 24 PSI | 100% Meth via dual BM5 | 94 Octane
BMS: JB4, Map 6 | WMI | 5" FMIC | OCC | DCI | Cowel Filters
TMAP: 3.5 barr
xHP Stage 3 (v2.0)
VRSF CP | HKS BOV
RB PCV Valve
NGK 5992 Plugs @ .020

Maintenance:
2018 - A/T Replaced | Plugs | Ign Coils | Walnut Blasting
2019 - Index 12 Injectors | VCG | OFHG & O-rings | Alternator w/ Clutch Pulley | Water Pump & TStat
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dpaul dpaul is offline
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Default 06-03-2019, 11:06 AM

That's my point, actually. Batteries clearly don't decay on a fixed schedule. You wouldn't assess the status of a battery simply by determining it's date of manufacture. You'd read the voltage, put a load on it for a defined period of time, read the voltage again.

If ones "adaptive" charging system is too stupid to do that, it's not actually adaptive. It's just based on some table of predicted values. I don't think BMW would bother.

All registration seems to do is store the current mileage in the DME memory so that BMW techs can determine when the last battery replacement occurred.
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nebula nebula is offline
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Default 09-18-2019, 02:45 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haynpunch
So i went the least expensive route for now...

Checked ground strap, looks new still..
Changed the Voltage Regulator, easy 15-20min job vs replacing alternator, Contacts on Old vs New is significant, Part number on old vs new according to FCPeuro will not fit my car but in the description new part number replaces old so wasn't to worried about that.
Old VR Part#: F00M346033
New VR Part#: F00M346088
Ordered a new battery but...i took the old battery in for a load test first, ended up being good just needed "recharge" , Returned the new battery for now.

Put old battery on a slow 2amp charge for a day 13.2v, reinstalled, triple checked all wiring in battery compartment.

Started up, checked codes now I'm getting "2e97 Generator" code
at idle 14.1-14.6v, while driving 13.3-14.2 (using display hack)

Cleared code and it comes back (2e97 Generator) after restart

For now ill keep driving it and see if anything else comes up, hopefully i don't get stuck
Are you still driving with the "2e97" code with no issues? I just had the same Christmas Tree scenario and I replaced my battery with OEM (and properly registered it). I still had issues so I replaced the Voltage Regulator (exact same old and new models as yours), and I appear to have zero issues now except I'm getting the "2e97" code in ISTA. I would love to not have to buy an alternator if possible! Thanks in advance!!
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Default 09-22-2019, 06:24 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by nebula
Are you still driving with the "2e97" code with no issues? I just had the same Christmas Tree scenario and I replaced my battery with OEM (and properly registered it). I still had issues so I replaced the Voltage Regulator (exact same old and new models as yours), and I appear to have zero issues now except I'm getting the "2e97" code in ISTA. I would love to not have to buy an alternator if possible! Thanks in advance!!
Code still showing, running fine no issue, I just ignore the code


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codesx codesx is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 10:56 AM

Thought about a new thread, but I don't feel like I'm high-jacking as this is pretty closed out - but same-ish subject.

My car just went all christmass-tree on me... batter is at 9.6vdc.

Current Codes
2DEB Power management, vehicle wiring system control
2E97 Generator
Intermittent code (seems to come on when I'm touching my battery's ground cable)
2E8B Intelligent battery sensor, signal

I just replaced the alternator with OEM a few months back.

Clearly not charging.
Maybe defective battery
Maybe defective alternator
Maybe defective VR
Not sure yet if the IBS can cause this or not

Being that I'm at work and have no equipment or charger... it's a bit awkward and will take me a bit to address.

I'm open to opinions and such!

I'll find a way to charge it, test wiring on battery, test alternator voltage output later today/tomorrow. (I hate leaving the battery so low)

I've got to read up on the whole 'melting the positive distribution point' somewhere in the dash?
Also, I need to read up on the IBS. Though that code hasn't come up for months.

Honestly... I've changed the batteries on so many cars in the last two years... I don't even know if I did this one.

In hindsight, I think there were symptoms for 2 days, though no codes.
The last 3 starts, it took longer to catch and run, where it's typically instant.


--

2008 335i Convertible, E93, N54, A/T (200,000+ km)
Wheels: 322 | Tires: R.275/35r18, F.245/40r18
TUNE: JB4/Trebila | 24 PSI | 100% Meth via dual BM5 | 94 Octane
BMS: JB4, Map 6 | WMI | 5" FMIC | OCC | DCI | Cowel Filters
TMAP: 3.5 barr
xHP Stage 3 (v2.0)
VRSF CP | HKS BOV
RB PCV Valve
NGK 5992 Plugs @ .020

Maintenance:
2018 - A/T Replaced | Plugs | Ign Coils | Walnut Blasting
2019 - Index 12 Injectors | VCG | OFHG & O-rings | Alternator w/ Clutch Pulley | Water Pump & TStat
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codesx codesx is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 12:05 PM

Question: If not charging at all, how long do we typically get off a good battery fully charged? 10 minutes or 1 hour? (headlights will be on, no heater)

Got it charging. It appears to be receiving well.
I'll do a primitive load test after it sits at 100% for a while.
Then... hopefully she'll bring me home where I can deal more casually.
The winter beater comes out tonight anyways.


--

2008 335i Convertible, E93, N54, A/T (200,000+ km)
Wheels: 322 | Tires: R.275/35r18, F.245/40r18
TUNE: JB4/Trebila | 24 PSI | 100% Meth via dual BM5 | 94 Octane
BMS: JB4, Map 6 | WMI | 5" FMIC | OCC | DCI | Cowel Filters
TMAP: 3.5 barr
xHP Stage 3 (v2.0)
VRSF CP | HKS BOV
RB PCV Valve
NGK 5992 Plugs @ .020

Maintenance:
2018 - A/T Replaced | Plugs | Ign Coils | Walnut Blasting
2019 - Index 12 Injectors | VCG | OFHG & O-rings | Alternator w/ Clutch Pulley | Water Pump & TStat
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codesx codesx is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 01:48 PM

Battery only took up to 65% charge.
Currently removed it from car and put on charger alone, to see if it'll go above 12.4vdc. (car based load, or crap battery)

Dealer price is $293 CAD. They won't warranty if they don't register it themselves (for $130 CAD). Annoying... out looking for better prices.


--

2008 335i Convertible, E93, N54, A/T (200,000+ km)
Wheels: 322 | Tires: R.275/35r18, F.245/40r18
TUNE: JB4/Trebila | 24 PSI | 100% Meth via dual BM5 | 94 Octane
BMS: JB4, Map 6 | WMI | 5" FMIC | OCC | DCI | Cowel Filters
TMAP: 3.5 barr
xHP Stage 3 (v2.0)
VRSF CP | HKS BOV
RB PCV Valve
NGK 5992 Plugs @ .020

Maintenance:
2018 - A/T Replaced | Plugs | Ign Coils | Walnut Blasting
2019 - Index 12 Injectors | VCG | OFHG & O-rings | Alternator w/ Clutch Pulley | Water Pump & TStat
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Dave @ BMS/Fuel-It!'s Avatar
Dave @ BMS/Fuel-It! Dave @ BMS/Fuel-It! is offline
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Default 11-29-2019, 10:59 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by codesx
Battery only took up to 65% charge.
Currently removed it from car and put on charger alone, to see if it'll go above 12.4vdc. (car based load, or crap battery)

Dealer price is $293 CAD. They won't warranty if they don't register it themselves (for $130 CAD). Annoying... out looking for better prices.
Eshhhh. : (


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