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Default Toluene to increase Octane? - 09-24-2014, 12:58 AM

Hi,

Anybody has experience with Pure Toluene as to mix it with fuel to increase octane?

From reading around Toluene has (R+M)/2 of 114 octane so mixing it with the 93 fuel will increase the octane but I'm not sure if it's safe for the engine, any disadvantages or risks?

Any suggestions, recommendations?


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spectacula spectacula is offline
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Default 09-24-2014, 05:01 AM

im not sure of anyone using it on a n54/55 but my friend used it on his e46 m3 and like it
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Default 09-24-2014, 05:47 AM

I've been reading a little about different methods of increasing octane myself. Xylene is another high octane component. These are both in some octane boosters. Both are natural components of gasoline, less than 10%, if this is accurate:
http://bcn.boulder.co.us/basin/water...solinecomp.pdf
The xylene is about $20/gallon, I read somewhere that in the past it was a lot cheaper and a lot more popular.
I'm about to go thru the ingredients on paint thinners & chemicals and compare them to the gasoline composition, singling out the higher octane components, to see if any are cost effective. The MSDS available on the Home Depot web site will tell you the ingredients.


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boost junkie boost junkie is offline
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Default 09-24-2014, 08:17 AM

The disadvantage is its about $10 a gallon (for a 55 gal drum).
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Default 09-24-2014, 08:27 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rushan
Hi,

Anybody has experience with Pure Toluene as to mix it with fuel to increase octane?

From reading around Toluene has (R+M)/2 of 114 octane so mixing it with the 93 fuel will increase the octane but I'm not sure if it's safe for the engine, any disadvantages or risks?

Any suggestions, recommendations?
The internet is full of wives tales, the theory works but in the real world it is too expensive, dangerous and impractical.

I looked into this;
1. Buying Toluene even a 55gal drum will cost more money than paying $10 per gallon 100 octane race gas, after shipping, tax, hazmat fee, ect.

2. Depending on where you live you might need to purchase a hazmat license in order to store such a large amount of flammable/dangerous liquid.

3. Mixing will be a pain, dispensing an exact amount from a drum in your garage.

4. Toluene is a known carcinogen, avoiding exposure means buying and getting into a level 2 hazmat suit (not realistic), just a respirator rated for organic solvents is insufficient.

find 100 octane pump or use E85, If those are not available in your area use meth injection.


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Default 09-24-2014, 08:28 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by boost junkie
The disadvantage is its about $10 a gallon (for a 55 gal drum).
That's true but it's still cheaper than normal octane booster that give you only fraction of the octane boost,

Having octane 114 added on top of 93 octane fuel if it's the only available option to increase the octane would cost less than adding commercial octane boosters which includes cleaning agent and oil if I'm not mistaken.


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Default 09-24-2014, 08:32 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CHECKERED
The internet is full of wives tales, the theory works but in the real world it is too expensive, dangerous and impractical.

I looked into this;
1. Buying Toluene even a 55gal drum will cost more money than paying $10 per gallon 100 octane race gas, after shipping, tax, hazmat fee, ect.

2. Depending on where you live you might need to purchase a hazmat license in order to store such a large amount of flammable/dangerous liquid.

3. Mixing will be a pain, dispensing an exact amount from a drum in your garage.

4. Toluene is a known carcinogen, avoiding exposure means buying and getting into a level 2 hazmat suit (not realistic), just a respirator rated for organic solvents is insufficient.

find 100 octane pump or use E85
Thanks for the information,

The problem that I only have 95 RON and 98 RON which is similar to the 91 and 93 in US

No gas pumps with 100 but maybe I can source E85 from chemical tradings in Oil and gas field but do I need to change my fuel pump if I add E85?


09 E92 335i - Hot-Climate Middle East package, M Sports suspension, 19" Rims, 6AT fully built internals, bushings, raybestos clutches and sonnax with xHP stage 3, Differential lockdown, New RB Turbo CHRA, JB4 - Map 3 70 adder with N20 TMAP - MHD BMS Race Flash with Tuned Duty Bais and PID - BMS Oil Cooler Valve - RB PCV - K&N DCI - AFE Air Scoops - 98 Super Fuel - WAGNER FMIC - 3" down's, RB Inlets- BMS charge pipe With Tial BOV - BMS Meth Kit with FSB, 30/70 Water/Meth on CM12 nozzle
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Default 09-24-2014, 08:33 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by tboudre
I've been reading a little about different methods of increasing octane myself. Xylene is another high octane component. These are both in some octane boosters. Both are natural components of gasoline, less than 10%, if this is accurate:
http://bcn.boulder.co.us/basin/water...solinecomp.pdf
The xylene is about $20/gallon, I read somewhere that in the past it was a lot cheaper and a lot more popular.
I'm about to go thru the ingredients on paint thinners & chemicals and compare them to the gasoline composition, singling out the higher octane components, to see if any are cost effective. The MSDS available on the Home Depot web site will tell you the ingredients.
Let me know if you reach to any solid information


09 E92 335i - Hot-Climate Middle East package, M Sports suspension, 19" Rims, 6AT fully built internals, bushings, raybestos clutches and sonnax with xHP stage 3, Differential lockdown, New RB Turbo CHRA, JB4 - Map 3 70 adder with N20 TMAP - MHD BMS Race Flash with Tuned Duty Bais and PID - BMS Oil Cooler Valve - RB PCV - K&N DCI - AFE Air Scoops - 98 Super Fuel - WAGNER FMIC - 3" down's, RB Inlets- BMS charge pipe With Tial BOV - BMS Meth Kit with FSB, 30/70 Water/Meth on CM12 nozzle
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Default 09-24-2014, 09:34 AM

There's an old homebrew octane booster that I know of that uses toluene and xylene. I have yet to try it with the BMW, but it was widely known as a good recipe for octane in excess of 100RON.

Very simply put, it's
- 50% Toluene
- 25% Methanol
- 25% Xylene
- 50 ml of two-stroke oil.

5L mix + 40L 95 = 98
5L mix + 20L 95 = 100
5L mix + 15L 95 = 102


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Default 09-24-2014, 10:47 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by CHECKERED
The internet is full of wives tales, the theory works but in the real world it is too expensive, dangerous and impractical.

I looked into this;
1. Buying Toluene even a 55gal drum will cost more money than paying $10 per gallon 100 octane race gas, after shipping, tax, hazmat fee, ect.

2. Depending on where you live you might need to purchase a hazmat license in order to store such a large amount of flammable/dangerous liquid.

3. Mixing will be a pain, dispensing an exact amount from a drum in your garage.

4. Toluene is a known carcinogen, avoiding exposure means buying and getting into a level 2 hazmat suit (not realistic), just a respirator rated for organic solvents is insufficient.

find 100 octane pump or use E85, If those are not available in your area use meth injection.
Or just be a real man and upgrade your turbos, call it a day.


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Default 09-24-2014, 11:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rushan
Thanks for the information,

The problem that I only have 95 RON and 98 RON which is similar to the 91 and 93 in US

No gas pumps with 100 but maybe I can source E85 from chemical tradings in Oil and gas field but do I need to change my fuel pump if I add E85?
Do you guys have E85 in UAE ?!
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Default 09-24-2014, 11:52 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilphase
Do you guys have E85 in UAE ?!
Ba Ha Ha! I doubt it. Alcohol is only legal at the hotels, so I doubt they have much experience brewing up ethanol. I would expect them to have 200 octane gas, though!


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Default 09-24-2014, 12:03 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oilphase
Do you guys have E85 in UAE ?!
Not in pump stations but can be sourced from suppliers


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Default 09-24-2014, 02:19 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rushan
Not in pump stations but can be sourced from suppliers
Interesting !! now i have to move to UAE lol. Im no E85 expert but i guess you have to get SteveAZ LPFP stage2 to run E85. check his website http://www.fuel-it.biz/fuel-it/
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Default Octane - 09-24-2014, 03:47 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Element
There's an old homebrew octane booster that I know of that uses toluene and xylene. I have yet to try it with the BMW, but it was widely known as a good recipe for octane in excess of 100RON.

Very simply put, it's
- 50% Toluene
- 25% Methanol
- 25% Xylene
- 50 ml of two-stroke oil.

5L mix + 40L 95 = 98
5L mix + 20L 95 = 100
5L mix + 15L 95 = 102
I currently use this as a substitute to ethanol as we also done get any eth at the pumps, slight variation to the mix though,
2lt toluene
2lt xylene
1lt meth

Add this 5lt to 20lt pump and you can beat an n54 on map7 all day long...ave ign values of 1 and less on logs too...

Its a suitable substitute to eth if non is available, also works well on your normal fuel scalar/trims


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NihonX NihonX is offline
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Default 09-24-2014, 06:51 PM

I used to use four gallons of Xylene at a cost of $16.50/gal to a 14 gallon tank.
With a mix of eleven gallons of 93 octane at a cost of $2.39/gal (2009).
This would cost a total of about $23.90 for (10gal) Premium and $66 for (4gal) of Xylene.
A grand total of $89.90/tank for a rating of around 98.71 Octane.

My other option was to drive 45 miles away to the nearest 100 Octane station and fill up for about $7.50/gal. That ends up being $105/tank but at a waste for having to drive back.

Figure out your options and decide on that what is most convenient or even cost effective. Have fun!
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Default 09-24-2014, 06:56 PM

Lastly, I never had problems with seals being eaten up by the paint thinner. I never ran more than 30% Xylene and most of the time I ended up burning up the fuel within a few days, so it never had time to do any damage.
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NihonX NihonX is offline
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Default 09-24-2014, 06:56 PM

As far as Toluene goes, I've never found any at my local stores, so I have no experiences with it.
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Default 09-24-2014, 07:38 PM

My friend ran toluene in his 135i back in 2011. He had no issues with it... I want to say that he was actually running paint thinner that had a high toluene content. I work at a refinery and we deal with toluene and xylene in our MEK unit. These are VERY dangerous and corrosive substances. Be careful if you decide to go this route, but do know that it has def. been done.


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Default 09-24-2014, 11:24 PM

Thanks guys, this started to be interested topic with all the feedback


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Default 11-19-2014, 03:31 PM

Use toluene on many occasions up to 30% on my flash tuned N54.
It worked really well, until I discovered eth is a lot cheaper.
Would like to try some again and log it.
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Default 11-19-2014, 03:41 PM

Used to use toluene back when I had a Jackson Racing supercharged Integra GSR.


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Default 11-21-2014, 10:18 AM

I have the luck to get everything I want to toluene at a very affordable price (almost like gasoline).

But I'm waiting to know how much experience you have to take (30%?)
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Default 11-21-2014, 12:58 PM

I messed with Toluene and Xylene years ago but local accessibility to E85 has made them irrelevant for me. This was on a small block Chevy but I had better success with Xylene running 30% Xylene with 93 octane which is around 100 octane. We would get it at cost from a friend at a paint store. I haven't priced it lately but I don't think its as affordable as it used to be.


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Default 11-21-2014, 01:42 PM

I have pure toluene


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Too bad it kills all its pupils ....
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